2010-12 EoT cakes


One of the intentionally aged teas, Pu-Erh has a loyal following.

2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby solitude » Mar 1st, '14, 15:24

I was recently revisiting these cakes from my collections and I was a bit disappointed. Many of them have lost the higher notes and freshness, which is ok in the process of ageing, but there was not much left. I remember the samples back then as very active, filling the mouth and nose, whereas now there is usually just some green umani taste often paired with sourness or citric notes.

The 2010-11 Mansai which were my favorite are quite thin with some sharp bitterness in the early infusions, only the huigan is worth to mention. The 2011 mannuo is a ok, but nowhere near the excellence described in some posts here on teachet (or other blogs). 2012 Baotang and QiShenGu were average or even bellow. So far only the 2011 Nannuo and 2010 Banpen lived up the expectations. 2010 Manmai and Bangwei will be sampled soon.

A common positive feature of the EoT productions is the qi, durability and low roughness in later infusions. This might be appealing for some sheng drinker, but I rather prefer 6 above average steeps than 12-15 average (boring) steeps.
I would be very interested to read other opinions about these teas.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby William » Mar 1st, '14, 15:47

Hi,

How are you storing this Bing?
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby solitude » Mar 1st, '14, 15:56

William wrote:Hi,

How are you storing this Bing?


I have stored them in a more humid part of my pumidor, which might be a factor. However other cakes are doing ok.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby William » Mar 1st, '14, 16:29

solitude wrote:
William wrote:Hi,

How are you storing this Bing?


I have stored them in a more humid part of my pumidor, which might be a factor. However other cakes are doing ok.


I store my bing quite differently, therefore I can not help you.

~ The only thing that comes to mind, is to ask if you store this bing sealed in some way? Or you just store with their wrappers?
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby shah82 » Mar 1st, '14, 17:22

I mostly have the same sort of feelings. I'd just switch the Mannuo and Nannuo. The Mannuo, I'd accepted would always be relatively thin in taste, like many Mengsongs. Yes, it has lost some-most of that Banzhangy fruit flourish, but I think it still has done well in increasing in body and texture, and the qi is still great. For my tastes, the Nannuo has always been a little too mellow and sweet, and with not enough power and distinctiveness in taste and aftertaste. However, over time, the propensity for huigans has decreased. In comparison, the YS Yakouzhai has done well, even if it's not as boutique (and hasn't surpassed) as the EoT Douyizhai.

The '10 Bangwei has subsided into a mellow and understatedly sophisticated tea. Not a whole lot of top taste, but definitely a little bit of flourish, and some good work on aftertastes.

The '10 and '11 Bulangs are mostly just satisfactory. Slump in the top taste like many other teas, but seeming to work through it. The last try at the '11 Bulang was quite decent in my memory.

'11 GFZ is a bit thinner in taste, but body was okay and qi was very strong.

The big thing to note is that 4-6 year old puerh are definitely not at their best. We will know if these cakes are any good around 2017-18, and there aren't really obvious issues other than excess green-ness.

In comparison to teas made from other places...YS '09 Road to Yiwu teas are not doing well at all, from my experiences with samples. '10 fall Xikong has a bit of Assam element growing--which could well be just the impact of lobular leaf. I know Hobbes has complained about the hongchafication of the '11 version. '09 Sanhetang--the Jingmai has lost most of its fruitiness in the top taste as well as astringency, but it's pretty incredible right now. Have not tried the Diangu since Xmas '11, so no idea. Not tried the Pasha in a long time. Gift set JingGu has done well.

So, so far, the clear winners in quality aging of younger tea that has been here most of its life has been Sanhetang. I think there is some benefit for higher quality processing--I think that the EoT '12 Bulang has definitely benefited from better process. However, the basic quality of the leaf is what determines how well it ages in the drier storage here in Atlanta. The 2011 EoT Bulang is still the better tea without the improvement in processing, for example.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby MarshalN » Mar 2nd, '14, 23:22

shah82 wrote:there aren't really obvious issues other than excess green-ness.


As if this isn't enough to kill the tea.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby Tead Off » Mar 2nd, '14, 23:38

MarshalN wrote:
shah82 wrote:there aren't really obvious issues other than excess green-ness.


As if this isn't enough to kill the tea.

Don't you think that excess green-ness is due to an overly dry storage condition and not necessarily the tea?
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby chrl42 » Mar 2nd, '14, 23:47

Tead Off wrote:
MarshalN wrote:
shah82 wrote:there aren't really obvious issues other than excess green-ness.


As if this isn't enough to kill the tea.

Don't you think that excess green-ness is due to an overly dry storage condition and not necessarily the tea?

I find them often from plantation teas or not enough of sun-drying. :D
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby shah82 » Mar 2nd, '14, 23:51

No, they were always green.

I do not necessarily agree that they'd kill off a tea. However MarshalN has had far more tea than me to make that opinion. I do believe it was a processing error that diminished the future prospects of a tea. However, until pretty recently, there wasn't a really solid idea of how to processed non-chopped up leaves.

In earlier times, circa 2006-2008, Sanhetang was criticized in Western circles for excessive fermentation before the shaqing step. So far, it looks like this method has turned out relatively well, but then again, the sort of leaves Sanhetang got to cook with back in the day outpaces most anything you see now, except on account of soup thickness (pronounced tendency for thin soups in many of those teas). This difference is always bigger than processing unless it's a real botch job.

The worst processing has always been some sort of oolong processing, though I'm not sure how they separate themselves in quality from being hongcha--but the point would be generating a very strong, purple aroma. The tea would last a few brews, and then start hurting your throat or otherwise dying in obnoxious ways.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby shah82 » Mar 3rd, '14, 00:00

chrl42, these EoT productions were never nearly as green as Dayi 8582, or any of the '08 Dayi Peacocks, or the '10/'11 Feng's tea that EoT also sold. Moreover, I think the problem of green-ness was actually a pretty major one outside of the Taiwan producers. Douji '07 Bada is green. I heard that the 12 Gentlemen cakes were green, plenty of Shuangjian Mengku cakes, etc, etc. Just a little too hot on the skillet and too much baking of leaves. Gonna be a lot of cakes that will be turned into daily fare, I think. I'm just waiting three or so years before I really start in on those EoT cakes. Hopefully.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby MarshalN » Mar 3rd, '14, 00:46

Tead Off wrote:
MarshalN wrote:
shah82 wrote:there aren't really obvious issues other than excess green-ness.


As if this isn't enough to kill the tea.

Don't you think that excess green-ness is due to an overly dry storage condition and not necessarily the tea?


Dry storage doesn't make the tea turn green - it just sucks the air out of the tea, but in a different way.

solitude wrote:The 2010-11 Mansai which were my favorite are quite thin with some sharp bitterness in the early infusions


This is the sort of thing that aged green tea would taste like
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby MarshalN » Mar 3rd, '14, 01:08

shah82 wrote: I heard that the 12 Gentlemen cakes were green


http://www.marshaln.com/2006/11/thursda ... er-2-2006/

You heard it here first. I never bought a cake from them as I decided it's too risky.

As for Dayi - there are a few cakes in the last years when they've experimented with weird processing, but by and large they're still more dependable than a lot of other brands when it comes to their production. Shuangjiang mengku, because of the nature of the raw materials, all end up tasting sort of like black tea. I was about to write a post about how bad teas go in all kinds of ways after having a few this past weekend, maybe I should go do that now.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby Tead Off » Mar 3rd, '14, 01:33

MarshalN wrote:
Tead Off wrote:
MarshalN wrote:
shah82 wrote:there aren't really obvious issues other than excess green-ness.


As if this isn't enough to kill the tea.

Don't you think that excess green-ness is due to an overly dry storage condition and not necessarily the tea?


Dry storage doesn't make the tea turn green - it just sucks the air out of the tea, but in a different way.

This is the sort of thing that aged green tea would taste like

I think I understand what you are referring to. In your blog, you mention how the Yiwu flavor begins to appear after some brews. I have had this experience with some teas. It's a bit surprising when it happens. But, I've noticed that further aging can bring this flavor out right away, making the tea more accessible immediately. It seems like the fermentation process needs to be continued or accelerated with some cakes. But, then again, a lot will depend on the leaf quality to begin with. For me, if the flavor of the fermented leaf is not there in the beginning, I will not buy a tea. I believe it is readily discernible.
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby William » Mar 3rd, '14, 02:44

Tead Off wrote:But, then again, a lot will depend on the leaf quality to begin with. For me, if the flavor of the fermented leaf is not there in the beginning, I will not buy a tea. I believe it is readily discernible.


+ 1.

I also think that how the leaves were processed is an important factor. More than once I tried PuErh made of good quality-leaf, but so poorly processed. :cry:
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Re: 2010-12 EoT cakes

Postby apache » Mar 3rd, '14, 05:23

MarshalN wrote:
As for Dayi - there are a few cakes in the last years when they've experimented with weird processing, but by and large they're still more dependable than a lot of other brands when it comes to their production. ...


It's a sad fact that their teas might not be the best in term of raw material you could buy with a given amount of money, but at least they know how to process the leaves correctly and this really shows after four or five years. :|
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