Unglazed pots?


Discussion on virtually any teaware related item.

Postby Salsero » Dec 7th, '08, 00:53

gingko wrote: Thanks shogun89 and wyardley! I think I will buy a $12 teapot, stop wondering what "ni" it is and play with it. It's very good price!


The Knights Who Say 'Ni' demand a sacrifice. ... We shall say 'ni' again to you if you do not appease us.
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Postby chrl42 » Dec 7th, '08, 02:02

gingko wrote:A question off the topic.
Since Shogun89 mentioned Yunnan source, and I have been tempted by a few pots in Yunnan source - Is this one really zhu ni?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Yixing-teapot-125ml-Zhu-Ni-Xi-Shi-Gong-Fu-Cha_W0QQitemZ350066963075QQihZ022QQcategoryZ1238QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262


Method used on that pot is called 調砂 Tiao Sha, mixing with big particles. Usually done on low-quality Zhuni to look like Lao Zhuni or to enhance the solidity.

To let you know how Zhuni looks like,
I will post 2 pots made by famous Zhuni master 杨小泉 Yang Xiao Quan.

[img]http://cnc4.kabiqi.com//pic/2007/7/28/xiaodie59/毛国强/DSC09171.jpg[/img]
Xiao Mei Yao Zhuni

[img]http://cnc4.kabiqi.com//pic/2007/7/28/xiaodie59/高群/DSC09671.jpg[/img]
Zhao Zhuang Lao Zhuni

Both are 1900 RMB, roughly about 300 USD

If not knowing what to do, there is a quote 無皺不朱 Wu Zhou Bu Zhu, no wrinkle no Zhuni. That wrinkle is one way to discern the originality of Zhuni..
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Re: Unglazed pots?

Postby pb2q » Dec 7th, '08, 03:25

capheind wrote:Anyone know of any other clays used for unglazed teapots other than Yixing? I don't have anything against Yixing (I have a couple) but I'm just curious.


The Japanese teapot world has a few unglazed branches. There are shudei (red clay) teapots. The clay looks like terra cotta.

Then there are some Japanese clays that seem very similar to Yixing, and the pottery influenced by Yixing teapots. Check out these links:

http://hojotea.com/item_e/purpleclay.htm
http://hojotea.com/item_e/mumyoi.htm

I've never handled any of these.
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Postby capheind » Dec 7th, '08, 14:37

@wyardley: Thanks, I'll poke around those. I'm looking for small and affordable, and a few of them seem to fit the bill.
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Postby gingkoseto » Dec 7th, '08, 18:56

Salsero wrote:
gingko wrote: Thanks shogun89 and wyardley! I think I will buy a $12 teapot, stop wondering what "ni" it is and play with it. It's very good price!


The Knights Who Say 'Ni' demand a sacrifice. ... We shall say 'ni' again to you if you do not appease us.


:lol: We do look very much like a cult society here :P
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Postby gingkoseto » Dec 7th, '08, 19:01

chrl42 wrote:
gingko wrote:A question off the topic.
Since Shogun89 mentioned Yunnan source, and I have been tempted by a few pots in Yunnan source - Is this one really zhu ni?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Yixing-teapot-125ml-Zhu-Ni-Xi-Shi-Gong-Fu-Cha_W0QQitemZ350066963075QQihZ022QQcategoryZ1238QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262


Method used on that pot is called 調砂 Tiao Sha, mixing with big particles. Usually done on low-quality Zhuni to look like Lao Zhuni or to enhance the solidity.

To let you know how Zhuni looks like,
I will post 2 pots made by famous Zhuni master 杨小泉 Yang Xiao Quan.

[img]http://cnc4.kabiqi.com//pic/2007/7/28/xiaodie59/毛国强/DSC09171.jpg[/img]
Xiao Mei Yao Zhuni

[img]http://cnc4.kabiqi.com//pic/2007/7/28/xiaodie59/高群/DSC09671.jpg[/img]
Zhao Zhuang Lao Zhuni

Both are 1900 RMB, roughly about 300 USD

If not knowing what to do, there is a quote 無皺不朱 Wu Zhou Bu Zhu, no wrinkle no Zhuni. That wrinkle is one way to discern the originality of Zhuni..


Thanks a lot for all this information. The 2 expensive pots look so beautiful!
And about adding sands to promote solidity of the clay - I heard sometimes a zhu ni pot may be broken by hot water very early in its life but good quality ones will last for long. Is it because low quality zhu ni is generally fragile compare with other kinds of clay?

Also wyardley made a good point that the teapot I spoke of has "zhu ni" in quote marks in its title. Normally, if we see the term "zhu ni" in quote marks, does it mean a zhu ni of not high quality, or it could simply mean any kind of clay that is red color?
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Postby wyardley » Dec 7th, '08, 19:05

chrl42 wrote:If not knowing what to do, there is a quote 無皺不朱 Wu Zhou Bu Zhu, no wrinkle no Zhuni. That wrinkle is one way to discern the originality of Zhuni..


Though the wrinkles can be faked, sometimes at least somewhat convincingly.
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Postby chrl42 » Dec 8th, '08, 00:37

gingko wrote:Thanks a lot for all this information. The 2 expensive pots look so beautiful!
And about adding sands to promote solidity of the clay - I heard sometimes a zhu ni pot may be broken by hot water very early in its life but good quality ones will last for long. Is it because low quality zhu ni is generally fragile compare with other kinds of clay?

Never heard that, but Zhunis are generally fragile than other clays. First it's mined from Nuo ni(soft clay) ore bed, second its 氣孔 (air hole) are few so very weak at radical temperature change.
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Postby chrl42 » Dec 8th, '08, 00:46

wyardley wrote:
chrl42 wrote:If not knowing what to do, there is a quote 無皺不朱 Wu Zhou Bu Zhu, no wrinkle no Zhuni. That wrinkle is one way to discern the originality of Zhuni..


Though the wrinkles can be faked, sometimes at least somewhat convincingly.

Ya, but 'faked' wrinkles are rather easily to be noticed.

Normally they don't draw wrinkles on bottom, lid, inside of body, button etc..but real Zhuni pots will have wrinkles even on bottom or spout.

Or there is a way to find joint lines, those lines are due to high shrinkage of Zhuni. Zhuni pots have joint lines on spout, inside of lid, in the back of body etc..just any spot that two different pieces are joined.

If not, there is always 'ping' test..
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Postby pb2q » Dec 8th, '08, 02:19

chrl42 wrote:If not, there is always 'ping' test..


chrl42, please elaborate on the 'ping' test.

Thanks.
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Postby TaiPing Hou Kui » Dec 8th, '08, 02:43

Chinese Teapot Gallery on e-bay has some nice Yixing pots that are quite small...that is where I got a few of mine that I use for Pu.

-Nick (TaiPing)
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Postby chrl42 » Dec 8th, '08, 03:22

pb2q wrote:
chrl42 wrote:If not, there is always 'ping' test..


chrl42, please elaborate on the 'ping' test.

Thanks.

There's a clip Guang did with his Zhunis
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_OoIxP5zYE

Another to notice, 'ping' doesn't just mean a sound of high tone, rather metallic tone than glassware (as it is clay contained with more iron than quartz). It should have a nice echoing sound, so better be 'qing' than 'ping' IMO.
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