Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!


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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby MarshalN » Dec 28th, '12, 03:52

Ambrose wrote:Taiwanese tea pot by Mr Lin Kuo Li

Testing with Gaoshan, thickens and deepens the body, places the aftertaste in the throat vs on the tongue.


Just curious, what's the texture/colour of this thing inside?
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby the_economist » Dec 28th, '12, 08:24

ImmortaliTEA wrote:No those are definitely good Hei Sha if they are the same 70 ml versions of the ones I have. Very strong rounding and thickens mouthfeel heavily. Can demolish aroma in certain instances but this is avoided through choosing a tea whose major characteristics do not include aroma (such as Ripe Puerh, very old Sheng, aged oolong, or high roasted anything) or just seasoning it heavily and in time it will erase aroma less and less and eventually start to give back to the brews and create something really flavorful & Qi filled!


haha cool, im not entirely sure its sandy, although it does look like there are fine sand particles scattered throughout. still thinking about what to use in it.
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tea_love » Dec 28th, '12, 14:24

Hello everyone,
Below is my new yixing teapot. I bought the item from zen8tea. He claims it is quingshuini.

Please tell me what you think about this teapot (clay,craftsmanship) ?

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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tingjunkie » Dec 28th, '12, 16:03

For the price, that's a very good "learning" pot tea_love. It will be great for you to start figuring out how Yixing changes aromas, flavors, and mouthfeel, and to begin seeing how Yixing can season and take on patina over time. Also, you can get some practice figuring out the tea/pot pairing challenge. In short, looks like a perfectly decent useable pot that you paid a fair price for, but the clay and craftsmanship are both common modern stuff. Not overpaying for a simple honest pot which fits this description is getting harder to do though, so I'd feel good about it if I were you. ;)

How high fired does the clay seem compared to your DTH pot?
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tingjunkie » Dec 28th, '12, 16:22

ImmortaliTEA wrote:
the_economist wrote:Picked up this pair of pots recently, 3-4 cup size. Seller marked as heini but looks like zini to me.

Image


No those are definitely good Hei Sha if they are the same 70 ml versions of the ones I have. Very strong rounding and thickens mouthfeel heavily. Can demolish aroma in certain instances but this is avoided through choosing a tea whose major characteristics do not include aroma (such as Ripe Puerh, very old Sheng, aged oolong, or high roasted anything) or just seasoning it heavily and in time it will erase aroma less and less and eventually start to give back to the brews and create something really flavorful & Qi filled!


I respectfully disagree with all of the above.

1) Those do not look like hei sha to me. Maybe hei ni.
2) No pot should ever "demolish" flavor or aroma. That's usually a sign of extremely low firing, or oxide additives in the clay.
3) Old sheng, aged oolongs, and heavily roasted oolongs should all still have TONS of aroma. If not, it's almost certainly crap tea.
4) In my personal opinion, a teapot has almost nothing to do with Qi. A placeebo effect at the very most. Don't drink the Kool-aid on that theory please!
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby ImmortaliTEA » Dec 28th, '12, 17:00

tingjunkie wrote:
ImmortaliTEA wrote:
the_economist wrote:Picked up this pair of pots recently, 3-4 cup size. Seller marked as heini but looks like zini to me.

Image


No those are definitely good Hei Sha if they are the same 70 ml versions of the ones I have. Very strong rounding and thickens mouthfeel heavily. Can demolish aroma in certain instances but this is avoided through choosing a tea whose major characteristics do not include aroma (such as Ripe Puerh, very old Sheng, aged oolong, or high roasted anything) or just seasoning it heavily and in time it will erase aroma less and less and eventually start to give back to the brews and create something really flavorful & Qi filled!


I respectfully disagree with all of the above.

1) Those do not look like hei sha to me. Maybe hei ni.
2) No pot should ever "demolish" flavor or aroma. That's usually a sign of extremely low firing, or oxide additives in the clay.
3) Old sheng, aged oolongs, and heavily roasted oolongs should all still have TONS of aroma. If not, it's almost certainly crap tea.
4) In my personal opinion, a teapot has almost nothing to do with Qi. A placeebo effect at the very most. Don't drink the Kool-aid on that theory please!


I was of the opinion that if a Hei Ni pot had sand mixed in then it was to be referred as Hei-Sha so I apologize if that was incorrect. About the aroma: if these pots are in fact the same exact ones I got from Sample Tea, then yes they are clearly labeled as low medium fired and I realize some people only like high-fired pots but I personally have quite a few low and low medium fired pots that brew great cups of tea for me. When I purchased them I was specifically looking for a clay that was very porous, rounded heavily, and hopefully kept aroma as much as possible but if it didn't I wouldn't be worried because aroma is of the least importance to me when brewing the specific teas I mentioned. Yes I do realize these teas still have aroma but for me personally (my subjective opinion) aroma is the very last in order of importance of characteristics to me after Cha Qi, Hui Gan, and mouthfeel. Now I have to say I completely and utterly disagree with what you said about the "teapot having almost nothing to do with Qi". I have personally experienced how different clays of different porosities can affect how much Qi is released into the cup. It is fairly obvious to me that when a more porous clay is used, it tends to eat up some Qi just as much as it does to the aroma or any other characteristic for that matter. This I believe is PART of the reason most people like to drink nicely aged Sheng in a harder more dense clay such as Zhu Ni so not only aroma will be kept intact but the ever so important Qi as well. Now if you are denying the existence of Qi in tea altogether (not saying you are) then that's a different issue altogether. Since this is written word with no possible way to see emotions attached I will clarify and say everything I have written is with the utmost respect as you are one of the people who really got me interested in Gong Fu Cha so I will say that I have the highest respect for you and your knowledge/expertise. What I wrote is simply my subjective opinion about Hei Ni which has been disputed by others on here as well. Oh well I guess I just like my tea "rounded". Lol. Thanks for challenging me TJ nobody would ever learn a thing if we all just agreed all the time!
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tea_love » Dec 28th, '12, 18:13

tingjunkie wrote:For the price, that's a very good "learning" pot tea_love. It will be great for you to start figuring out how Yixing changes aromas, flavors, and mouthfeel, and to begin seeing how Yixing can season and take on patina over time. Also, you can get some practice figuring out the tea/pot pairing challenge. In short, looks like a perfectly decent useable pot that you paid a fair price for, but the clay and craftsmanship are both common modern stuff. Not overpaying for a simple honest pot which fits this description is getting harder to do though, so I'd feel good about it if I were you. ;)

How high fired does the clay seem compared to your DTH pot?


Thanks Tingjunkie.
I didn't use the DTH pot yet. These days I spend more time on the "learning" pot. I'm using it with "Human" picked Tin Guan Yin (30% oxidization and medium roasted). I will wait for the gaiwan to come to make a test how difference the pot make to the tea. So far the aroma is still there when I made TGY from it.

About the DTH pot, they say it is medium fired so I still dont know what tea to pair with.Any suggestion ? I post again the pot shape so maybe you can help me out. (Sorry if I abuse your experience again :lol: ).
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tingjunkie » Dec 28th, '12, 19:12

ImmortaliTEA wrote:I was of the opinion that if a Hei Ni pot had sand mixed in then it was to be referred as Hei-Sha so I apologize if that was incorrect.


No worries, it's an easy misconception to have. :wink: I wish making real zisha was as easy as mixing sand into zini. Things would be easier for us tea lovers!

ImmortaliTEA wrote:About the aroma: if these pots are in fact the same exact ones I got from Sample Tea, then yes they are clearly labeled as low medium fired and I realize some people only like high-fired pots but I personally have quite a few low and low medium fired pots that brew great cups of tea for me.


As always, to each their own. I use a medium fired duanni pot which rounds teas more than any other pot I own specifically for some slightly funky liu an for just this reason. You should be extra careful with heini pots though, as it may not be the firing level. I used to have a mission to find a good heini pot, but after testing 5 of them, they all were total flavor/aroma erasers, and I suspect it was because they all contained some level of manganese oxide to achieve their black color. Real heini or heisha is much harder to find than people realize. I have a friend (a serious Yixing expert) who was willing to sell me a set of 5 real heini shui pings, but I couldn't afford it. Just one of those pots would have been quite pricy, even with the friend discount. I have since given up the search.

ImmortaliTEA wrote:Now I have to say I completely and utterly disagree with what you said about the "teapot having almost nothing to do with Qi". I have personally experienced how different clays of different porosities can affect how much Qi is released into the cup... Now if you are denying the existence of Qi in tea altogether (not saying you are) then that's a different issue altogether.


Oh no, I think Cha Qi is most definitely a real thing, whether we want to analyze the scientific reasons behind it or not. I've been very lucky to sample many teas with some serious Qi. Some were made in various pots, but more were made in modern sub $20 gaiwans, and they got me tea drunk just the same! I'm really not sure how you would do a side by side blind comparison to judge whether a gaiwan or a low fired teapot releases more Qi, since the effects are not usually felt instantaneously, and could be coming from either cup. However, I think the theory that a low fired pot could absorb some is far more plausible than the idea that an older tea pot gives more Qi than a younger one, as I see some people around here tend to believe. :roll: That's the "Kool-aid" I was referring to.


ImmortaliTEA wrote:Since this is written word with no possible way to see emotions attached I will clarify and say everything I have written is with the utmost respect as you are one of the people who really got me interested in Gong Fu Cha so I will say that I have the highest respect for you and your knowledge/expertise. What I wrote is simply my subjective opinion about Hei Ni which has been disputed by others on here as well. Oh well I guess I just like my tea "rounded". Lol. Thanks for challenging me TJ nobody would ever learn a thing if we all just agreed all the time!


Thanks for your kind words, but I'm merely a young student of tea and teaware myself. The respect is mutual, and I'm glad you are open to straightforward debates! I agree, the rate of learning is slowed down if we are too "nice" to ever challenge each other. Good show! :wink:
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tingjunkie » Dec 28th, '12, 19:22

tea_love wrote:About the DTH pot, they say it is medium fired so I still dont know what tea to pair with.Any suggestion ?


Yes, pair the pot with this book. Read that, then you'll know what you should do with the pot. :wink:
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby Ambrose » Dec 28th, '12, 19:29

MarshalN wrote:
Ambrose wrote:Taiwanese tea pot by Mr Lin Kuo Li

Testing with Gaoshan, thickens and deepens the body, places the aftertaste in the throat vs on the tongue.


Just curious, what's the texture/colour of this thing inside?


I had the same curiosity before I purchased. I figured only one way to find out :)

I didn't expect much from this teapot just bought it because of the looks and curiosity of taiwanese clay. From the looks I just thought it was some colored high fired pot I didn't think it would affect the water or tea much.

It has greatly impressed and surprised me. It makes the brew very smooth, soft and thick, greater aromas and aftertaste in the finish placed in the throat rather than upfront aromas on the tongue.

The pot is extremely lightweight for its size, clay looks to be very finely processed. The inside clay feels velvety to the touch, tender. Smells like good iron clay, the firing is low, just enough to rectify it I suppose. My thoughts based on some research and based on some of my other pots is that the material is some sort of taiwan mountain clay with reduction firing finely processed and wheel thrown.
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby bagua7 » Dec 28th, '12, 19:56

tea_love wrote:Please tell me what you think about this teapot (clay,craftsmanship)


Clay: QSN it is indeed
Craftsmanship: commercial pot, but over time it will brew better and better tea. It's still a baby, it will mature in 20 years time like a human being. In 40-yeasr time it will be an amazing pot. :)

Enjoy!


ImmortaliTEA wrote:Now I have to say I completely and utterly disagree with what you said about the "teapot having almost nothing to do with Qi".


:) Totally agree, sorry TJK :mrgreen:

Ambrose, lovely pot. Did you purchase it in the emerald island? :)
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tea_love » Dec 28th, '12, 20:24

tingjunkie wrote:
tea_love wrote:About the DTH pot, they say it is medium fired so I still dont know what tea to pair with.Any suggestion ?


Yes, pair the pot with this book. Read that, then you'll know what you should do with the pot. :wink:


seem a good book to me. I will read it. Tks
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tea_love » Dec 28th, '12, 20:25

bagua7 wrote:
tea_love wrote:Please tell me what you think about this teapot (clay,craftsmanship)


Clay: QSN it is indeed
Craftsmanship: commercial pot, but over time it will brew better and better tea. It's still a baby, it will mature in 20 years time like a human being. In 40-yeasr time it will be an amazing pot. :)

Enjoy!


thanks Bagua7
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby tingjunkie » Dec 28th, '12, 22:16

bagua7 wrote:
ImmortaliTEA wrote:Now I have to say I completely and utterly disagree with what you said about the "teapot having almost nothing to do with Qi".


:) Totally agree, sorry TJK :mrgreen:


Don't apologize bagua, back up your claim. :P

Exactly how have your teachers demonstrated this to you? I'm curious. And don't even tell me the people selling you the teapots are the one's demonstrating it! :mrgreen: Too easy.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not denying you the right to have your opinion, but I figured I'd give you the chance to contribute something of value to the discussion since you seem to have some interesting experience that many of us do not.
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Re: Official/Different Yixing Show Off Topic!

Postby bagua7 » Dec 29th, '12, 00:11

OK, you want to know. This is a bit personal but hey we know each other (as forum users) quite well now that we (or I) should start laying our cards on the table.

I have been practicing meditation as well as Chinese internal energetic practices for some time now (ten years) quite intensively so basically I can see things that normal people can't due to lack of mental training (having what is popularly called a Matrix mind, like in the movie I suppose :) ).

The Chinese guy who told me some of the tricks of this trade is a non-believer even though he has been drinking tea for nearly 30 years now, although he fully believes that each pot has got their own personality, and he also has some favourite pots for specific teas he never mixes with other teas. All these pots are over 20 years of age and they all beat my pots by a mile :) According to him my pots are still babies, they need to mature to deliver their full potential. Here's where Qi comes into play.

One of his best mates is an interesting fellow also from HK, who used to scuba dive the seas of SE Asia searching for shipwrecks and stuff. He has got several pots from both the Ming and Qing dynasties solely dedicated to his very old puerh cakes all found during his diving adventures. He would never use a pot "younger" that 50 years to brew those teas otherwise the youth of the pot would mess up the Qi of the old cake. He would use old porcelain if the pot is unavailable (he doesn't carry his ancient pots with him all the time because they are worth a lot of $ ). A Feng Shui fanatic and also a Taoist he also agrees with my views about Qi and how the maturity (and purity of the clay used; he is not too keen of today's Yixings because in his opinion they mix the clays quite a lot) of the pot affects tea brewing and quality of the brew.

Unfortunately I don't have access to such old pots let alone for someone living in a Western country, and still I don't think I would be able to afford them anyway. :lol:

Qi/spirit/high level of consciousness is in everything not just Yixing pots and tea. ;)
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