Show off your Kettle!!


Discussion on virtually any teaware related item.

Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby miig » Jun 30th, '14, 11:36

bonescwa wrote:
blairswhitaker wrote:a tetsubin IS a cast iron kettle.

[...] cast iron kettles that are not marketed as tetsubin. They would probably be cheaper but provide the same benefit to the water.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000I6FF1 ... 15&simLd=1


Hi, that is an interesting statement - wouldn't you be worried that a 20$ tetsubin may be made of inferior material an thus influence the water in a negative way, just most people probably would suspect a 20$ clay pot to do?
I saw Tetsubins which cost about 100€ (150$) here and wondered whether they could provide sufficient quality, but never about such a cheap piece - it would be glad if they'd perfom as well as the others, but is that possible?
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Postby bonescwa » Jun 30th, '14, 11:43

I don't know the answer to that, I'm just asking. Of course people are going to pay more for an aesthetic product and that is justified, but for people like me who are trying to be frugal are always looking out for cheaper alternatives.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby the_economist » Jun 30th, '14, 12:10

bonescwa wrote:
blairswhitaker wrote:a tetsubin IS a cast iron kettle.

I think think he is asking if there are cast iron kettles that are not marketed as tetsubin. They would probably be cheaper but provide the same benefit to the water.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000I6FF1 ... 15&simLd=1


That isn't meant to be used for boiling water that will be consumed.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby bonescwa » Jun 30th, '14, 13:00

the_economist wrote:
bonescwa wrote:
blairswhitaker wrote:a tetsubin IS a cast iron kettle.

I think think he is asking if there are cast iron kettles that are not marketed as tetsubin. They would probably be cheaper but provide the same benefit to the water.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000I6FF1 ... 15&simLd=1


That isn't meant to be used for boiling water that will be consumed.

True, it's for humidity. I'm wondering if there is something between this and a 300 dollar tetsubin.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby devilducklings » Jun 30th, '14, 13:24

bonescwa wrote:I think think he is asking if there are cast iron kettles that are not marketed as tetsubin. They would probably be cheaper but provide the same benefit to the water.


Yes, that is what I meant. Thanks bonescwa

the_economist wrote:That isn't meant to be used for boiling water that will be consumed.


I have been reading about cast iron kettle offered on amazon.com
Many of them are not recommended for boiling water for tea, but I have strong impression that the discouragement is due to they (both seller and buyer) are afraid of adverse health risk drinking water from rusty kettle, not because the water isnt drinkable.
Whereas tetsubin users are more rust-proof :D , little rust is actually expected.
Here is a link on amazon.com that sell cast iron kettle recommended for boiling water/tea:
http://www.amazon.com/Cajun-Cookware-1- ... B000EWD15K

The only difference I get between cast iron kettle and tetsubin is that its inside is usually pre-seasoned and black.
I havent found any cast iron kettle with grey inside (using Hojo's term : activated iron).
And cast iron kettle looks more thick walled than tetsubin which make it sturdier (I suppose?).

It would be interesting to hear if anyone here has made side by side direct comparison between the two.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby 茶藝-TeaArt08 » Jul 4th, '14, 02:14

Beyond the aesthetic beauty and craft of Japanese tetsubins and other kettles (ginbins, copper, etc.) there is also the functionality. These pieces that are linked to on Amazon are not only unattractive, they all look heavy and unwieldy. Not to mention the spouts do not appear as though they would pour nice, controlled, elegant streams of water (very hot water I might add) into the comparably small openings of senchado and gong fu teapots. Secondly, not all cast iron is equal. The specific constitutions of each caster's metal "alloy" differ.

When I pour a formal pour for a tea guest, the elegance of the setting, the teaware, and one's movements in preparing tea all contribute to the enjoyability, beauty, and quality of the experience and the tea. If you've poured a full tetsubin that is too heavy you'll understand why, right away, one would want to seek out a quality tetsubin. Like a properly balanced sword or knife, a well balanced tetsubin, one where the weight of the kettle and the shape and thickness of the handle (and its alignment) allow for any easy tilt to pour the scalding water surgically from a well designed, straight spout into a small pot, eases strain on ones arm and shoulder and increases the enjoyment of the pour.

With tetsubin I also prefer to have a lid that fits well and is not obnoxiously clanging back and forth as I tilt the tetsubin. My smaller, vintage tetsubin has a really nice pour and streams water very smoothly and can be thinned very easily. The lid is a snug fit, and the balance in hand is very comfortable; combine these attributes with its effect on water and its pleasing appearance and one has a very nice kettle and, to me, a worthy investment.

After watching this thread I logged back into Yahoo Japan and tagged a few kettles to see how things are selling. I saw two very nice kettles, generally much nicer than what I see on EBay right now, go for $120 and $170 dollars respectively. Of course there is still the fees and shipping but that adds anywhere from $30-$50. Still a good deal.

Blessings!
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Postby bonescwa » Jul 4th, '14, 11:01

So had anyone tried any type of cast iron pot that is not Japanese? Just curious if special Japanese cast iron vs regular cast iron makes a practical difference in the taste of the tea.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby debunix » Jul 4th, '14, 11:46

It would be an interesting test to play with a cast iron pot I already own, to see how it changes the taste of the tea--for a few tests, dealing with a pot that is not designed for tea use (not shaped/balanced for this) would be ok. But I'm not willing to sacrifice the seasoning on my pots for such a test, which I'm quite certain would not enhance the taste of the tea, as well as prevent significant contact between the iron at the water.

But it might be worth scouting Goodwill for a small cheap cast iron pot, running it through the self-clean cycle on the oven to completely remove all seasoning, and trying that, before investing in a proper tetsubin.

But what would be more practical for my current setups, where there is no chance of my heating all my water over charcoal in a tetsubin, would be something like some food-grade iron ball bearings that I could drop into the bottom of my stainless electric kettles. Not traditional in the least, of course, nor nearly as lovely as a fine tetsubin, but might work.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby JBaymore » Jul 4th, '14, 15:25

debunix wrote:........would be something like some food-grade iron ball bearings that I could drop into the bottom of my stainless electric kettles. Not traditional in the least, of course, nor nearly as lovely as a fine tetsubin, but might work.


In certain Japanese Tea Ceremony situations, the host will put small pieces of broken cast iron kettles in the bottom of the Chagama being used to heat the water..... so that the just boiling water at the bottom has a nucleation place for the bubbles to form on... and becasue of this the little iron pieces cause a sound in the bottom of the Chagama as it boils.

best,

................john
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby debunix » Jul 4th, '14, 15:36

So maybe a little tradition in my reinvention of the wheel after all!
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby Fuut » Jul 10th, '14, 08:13

I think this would be a rather good looking chagama:

http://www.aoijapan.com/tsuba-mumeiunsi ... ku-chagama
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Show off your Kettle!!

Postby Pig Hog » Jul 11th, '14, 07:56

What do you guys think of the way certain tetsubin work with certain teapots?

Hojo-san is very adamant that my soon-to-be Kunzan tetsubin is best used with Banko or bizen yaki but will not work well with reduction fired pots.

While I don't disagree with his far more expert opinion, I wonder whether everyone here pays such meticulous attention to what teaware combo they use and how much it affect the flavour of the tea for good or for worse?
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Postby bonescwa » Jul 11th, '14, 08:05

Although I'm just a beginner, that's where tea theory starts to sound off the deep end to me, just in a common sense sort of way. But if it gives you a nice placebo response then everybody wins.
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Re: Show off your Kettle!!

Postby William » Jul 11th, '14, 11:01

Pig Hog wrote:What do you guys think of the way certain tetsubin work with certain teapots?

Hojo-san is very adamant that my soon-to-be Kunzan tetsubin is best used with Banko or bizen yaki but will not work well with reduction fired pots.

While I don't disagree with his far more expert opinion, I wonder whether everyone here pays such meticulous attention to what teaware combo they use and how much it affect the flavour of the tea for good or for worse?


Just try by yourself if a certain combination works well or not. Consider that many variables come into play when we talk about tea wares' matching, e.g. water, mood, combination clay's teapot~tea. What Akira sad is completely correct, but we must remember that his recommendations are based on a number of variables that he has personally tried, but that may still differ during our sessions, such as those mentioned earlier.
My advice is to try every possible combination, then, adopt the ones you liked.

Regards.
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Show off your Kettle!!

Postby Pig Hog » Jul 11th, '14, 11:34

That's a fair point as different water will have an effect too. I hadn't really planned not to use it with the non-recommended pots, I just wondered to what extent it had an adverse effect on the tea.
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