Official what Oolong are You Drinking Right Now?

[ethan]

Dear Victoria, This Dr Chen is not the same as kyarazen's chen. Chen is a very common name in Taiwan. Even in this same city, Tainan, there is another Dr Chen selling tea, but it is one of those scams--cure all tonic. The "Dr" is sort of a joke for the tea guy, nickname given because he is a judge at tea competitions.

Interesting note about competitions. I have read here that competition entrants need to submit quite a bit of tea, 10 - 50 kg. What I just heard here is that almost all of it is returned. Entrants lose about 2 - 4 kg. Sounds much more reasonable.

I am "stacking" infusions much of the time. Get fuller flavor.

[Bok]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

[William]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

[jayinhk]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

I'm pretty sure LOTS of fertilizer is used on the tastiest Lishan oolongs, actually!

[William]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

I'm pretty sure LOTS of fertilizer is used on the tastiest Lishan oolongs, actually!

There are various degrees of mineral content, it's not just a question of black or white .. without talking on how different soils, typology of fertilizers, age of the bush, etc.. impact on the plant.

Just to give you a concrete example, soils rich of iron or calcium tend to have plants richer in mineral, even with use of fertilizer or frequent pruning .. the same plants, treated the same way, but in poorer soils, will probably have much less minerals.

[jayinhk]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

I'm pretty sure LOTS of fertilizer is used on the tastiest Lishan oolongs, actually!

There are various degrees of mineral content, it's not just a question of black or white .. without talking on how different soils, typology of fertilizers, age of the bush, etc.. impact on the plant.

Just to give you a concrete example, soils rich of iron or calcium tend to have plants richer in mineral, even with use of fertilizer or frequent pruning .. the same plants, treated the same way, but in poorer soils, will probably have much less minerals.

Just from what I've read, heavy fertilizer use is par for course on high mountain oolong tea in Taiwan. They want to maximize yield and flavor (and therefore, profit) so they definitely aren't going light!

A good fertilization regimen will cover micronutrient deficiencies if needed. I have to add magnesium to my plants because of a lack of Mg in the water here!

[William]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

I'm pretty sure LOTS of fertilizer is used on the tastiest Lishan oolongs, actually!

There are various degrees of mineral content, it's not just a question of black or white .. without talking on how different soils, typology of fertilizers, age of the bush, etc.. impact on the plant.

Just to give you a concrete example, soils rich of iron or calcium tend to have plants richer in mineral, even with use of fertilizer or frequent pruning .. the same plants, treated the same way, but in poorer soils, will probably have much less minerals.

Just from what I've read, heavy fertilizer use is par for course on high mountain oolong tea in Taiwan. They want to maximize yield and flavor (and therefore, profit) so they definitely aren't going light!

A good fertilization regimen will cover micronutrient deficiencies if needed. I have to add magnesium to my plants because of a lack of Mg in the water here!

Of course it's not possible to grow Gaoshan, especially in prized locations, without fertilizers or herbicides, too much risky, especially if your income depends on 1 or 2 harvest per year, how do you buy a 60k mercedes after all? .. but don't think fertilizers are so important for flavours, 'cause they just add mainly amino acids to plants. Generally amino acids tends to produce a sweet flavor, but Gaoshan are more than just sweet flavours.

[jayinhk]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

I'm pretty sure LOTS of fertilizer is used on the tastiest Lishan oolongs, actually!

There are various degrees of mineral content, it's not just a question of black or white .. without talking on how different soils, typology of fertilizers, age of the bush, etc.. impact on the plant.

Just to give you a concrete example, soils rich of iron or calcium tend to have plants richer in mineral, even with use of fertilizer or frequent pruning .. the same plants, treated the same way, but in poorer soils, will probably have much less minerals.

Just from what I've read, heavy fertilizer use is par for course on high mountain oolong tea in Taiwan. They want to maximize yield and flavor (and therefore, profit) so they definitely aren't going light!

A good fertilization regimen will cover micronutrient deficiencies if needed. I have to add magnesium to my plants because of a lack of Mg in the water here!

Of course it's not possible to grow Gaoshan, especially in prized locations, without fertilizers or herbicides, too much risky, especially if your income depends on 1 or 2 harvest per year, how do you buy a 60k mercedes after all? .. but don't think fertilizers are so important for flavours, 'cause they just add mainly amino acids to plants. Generally amino acids tends to produce a sweet flavor, but Gaoshan are more than just sweet flavours.

Nonsense, try growing a tea plant in poor soil without NPK fertilizer and see what happens!

As for amino acids, every enzyme in every biological organism is made up of amino acids--without amino acids, there is no life, let alone aroma!

Also micronutrients are commonly added to NPK fertilizers as needed to correct deficiencies. Mg and Zn boost tea yields significantly. Nutrient deficiencies will absolutely affect aroma and flavor, and appearance of the leaves, too.

[debunix]

I was just sad to have finished a thermos session with SeaDyke TKY because it came out especially smooth and mellow this afternoon and evening. When I get it right, it's so very comforting.

[William]

This morning I switched up my routine and prepared a higher grade oolong than I typically do first thing; Floating Leaves 2016 Spring LiShan. It is exceptionally buttery, sweet and smooth. The aromatics of wet leaf, liquor and empty pitcher are sweet, complex and subtly floral, really entrancing. Also, this LiShan has a very present lingering aftertaste.

It‘s easy – if it doesn’t have a present, and lingering aftertaste it is not a real Lishan, but a lower grade tea from another place.

From my experience, aftertaste is just the resultant of the high quantity of minerals present in the plant (and therefore, in the leaves we brew). Even authentic Li Shan oolong, can be without aftertaste, if the plants have been touched (e.g. fertilizers, pruned and so on ..) or harvested too many times.

I'm pretty sure LOTS of fertilizer is used on the tastiest Lishan oolongs, actually!

There are various degrees of mineral content, it's not just a question of black or white .. without talking on how different soils, typology of fertilizers, age of the bush, etc.. impact on the plant.

Just to give you a concrete example, soils rich of iron or calcium tend to have plants richer in mineral, even with use of fertilizer or frequent pruning .. the same plants, treated the same way, but in poorer soils, will probably have much less minerals.

Just from what I've read, heavy fertilizer use is par for course on high mountain oolong tea in Taiwan. They want to maximize yield and flavor (and therefore, profit) so they definitely aren't going light!

A good fertilization regimen will cover micronutrient deficiencies if needed. I have to add magnesium to my plants because of a lack of Mg in the water here!

Of course it's not possible to grow Gaoshan, especially in prized locations, without fertilizers or herbicides, too much risky, especially if your income depends on 1 or 2 harvest per year, how do you buy a 60k mercedes after all? .. but don't think fertilizers are so important for flavours, 'cause they just add mainly amino acids to plants. Generally amino acids tends to produce a sweet flavor, but Gaoshan are more than just sweet flavours.

Nonsense, try growing a tea plant in poor soil without NPK fertilizer and see what happens!

As for amino acids, every enzyme in every biological organism is made up of amino acids--without amino acids, there is no life, let alone aroma!

Also micronutrients are commonly added to NPK fertilizers as needed to correct deficiencies. Mg and Zn boost tea yields significantly. Nutrient deficiencies will absolutely affect aroma and flavor, and appearance of the leaves, too.

So, according to your reasoning, it's not possible to grow plants for tea harvesting without pruning them, without using fertilizers or herbicides and without adding minerals to the soil?

[jayinhk]

So, according to your reasoning, it's not possible to grow plants for tea harvesting without pruning them, without using fertilizers or herbicides and without adding minerals to the soil?

No, plenty of old trees flourish without any intervention in Northern Vietnam/Myanmar/Thailand/Yunnan since they are part of the ecosystem, and have been for centuries or even a milennium + in many cases. The issue with gaoshan is you're destroying delicate high mountain ecosystems for monoculture, and the soils up there aren't particularly good in many cases. Couple that with heavy rainfall (on steep slopes), which washes away humus and nutrients. If you want to grow anything worthwhile, heavy fertilizer use is absolutely a requirement. Eutrophication also appears to be an issue in Taiwanese agriculture, from the algal blooms I've seen in streams during my limited time there.

The destruction of these ecosystems/erosion is why the Taiwanese Government is removing some tea plants and banning cultivation in some areas (so they say), but with the whole political mess over there, other farms are allowed to keep doing their thing.

[ethan]

I have been offline since Thursday morning because I went to Sun Moon Lake & spent 2 days & nights w/ a priest/tea master who lives w/o wifi. It is interesting to read the discussion about fertilizer that I missed. The last week I have tasted goashan that is excellent but w/ the aftertaste presenting itself eventually. How strongly is the difference.

Organic gaoshan has presented less of a bad aftertasted, but some is there (as organic fertilizer contains the minerals etc.); &, the organic tea is so expensive.

The friend of a friend of mine who was my host at Sun Moon Lake is what he calls "partners" w/ organic farmers in Alishan area of Taiwan & in Hunan, China. I have written before about tea he sent me to sample in the USA. Now I know the prices & can say I don't know that any tea is worth those prices to me. It is cheaper to work on one's preparation & find an ideal teapot....

Before I forget, I want to say, I tried tea at a shop that specializes in Taiwan's oldest tea. I had 51 - 55 year old teas (supposedly). One cost 20,000 per jin (600 grams). I sampled 3 teas there. All were very good; yet, compared w/ teas of Dr Chen I have written about, all had much < flavor & did not show that 45 years more aging gave greater aged benefits.

Responding to the points made about not getting to taste or buy some teas. I think there is still plenty of good tea for us "unconnected" drinkers & most of what we cannot get or afford is tea we don't really want anyway. And a reminder: it is good to be open-minded. I thought I did not like boazhong, but I was lucky enough to find a wonderful one. It is a great green oolong & rivals the pleasure to be had from gaoshan.

It is a pleasure to read a few posts at a time. Hope we teachatters can be active. cheers

[ethan]

That 20,000 is Taiwan Dollars; so it a little > than a $1 per gram.

[kuánglóng]

I was just sad to have finished a thermos session with SeaDyke TKY because it came out especially smooth and mellow this afternoon and evening. When I get it right, it's so very comforting.

Sipping old Sea Dyke SX right now. I've kept some of it in a porcelain caddy for more than a year and it has turned pretty sweet and smooth in there.

[debunix]

I was just sad to have finished a thermos session with SeaDyke TKY because it came out especially smooth and mellow this afternoon and evening. When I get it right, it's so very comforting.

Sipping old Sea Dyke SX right now. I've kept some of it in a porcelain caddy for more than a year and it has turned pretty sweet and smooth in there.

I've never had anything but the SeaDyke TKY, the one Dad's calligraphy buddy introduced him to. I should check out the SX some day: it sounds like it may share the same decent, steady quality that is so desirable in the TKY.