Various newbie questions about Japanese greens!

[Mr. Usaji]

I have been wondering about this umami thing. In a tea context, "umami" seems to mean the "seaweed" or "fishy" aspect in the taste of sencha. But I always thought umami in food meant a meat-like taste, or the taste of MSG or soy sauce. Sencha doesn't and shouldn't taste like that! And I've never thought any other tea tasted "seaweedy" like sencha either.

So I'm confused about what "umami" means, or if tea-umami really has anything to do with the food version.

[entropyembrace]

I´ve heard people refering to puerh as being brothy or having a mushroom taste. And in some oolongs I´ve detected eggy and buttery flavours. I think those could also be described as umami.

[debunix]

You taste no umami in a nice earthy puerh? Many of my favorites have a delicious light smokiness that, together with some earthiness, makes a pleasing umami-like element for me. I find this more in the young shengs than the ripe pu, but have not yet had a truly old sheng to see if it is there or not.

As for umami in the oolongs, I find it there but to a lesser extent in some of the lighter roasted oolongs, in the background of the much showier meadow wildflowers and summer hay.

[Tead Off]

If I go by the definition I posted, I don't interpret the fermented earthiness or smokiness as umami as found in Puerh. To me, those are earthy and smoky flavors which I interpret as different than umami. But, I guess we can call anything umami as long as it has flavor. But, my taste buds register a tangible meaty, brothy, seaweedy, sometimes salty, fishy flavor unique to Japanese steamed teas. Since the word is Japanese, I am assuming the word has more reference to Japanese tea. I accept there is room for all kinds of interpretations with this kind of word or any word for that matter.

[debunix]

I would not call smokiness umami, or the scent of compost or damp forest floor umami; but sometimes that has these things, umami is present. I am here using umami in the sense of a savory flavor that is very strongly present in preserved meats like ham or salame, in some cheeses like parmesan or a really aged gouda or cheddar, the deep background flavor of soy sauce, and that people like to add via such things as bottles of MSG or 'liquid smoke'. And I get some of that in some young sheng puerhs, and to a lesser extent, sometimes it is there as a backdrop to the lighter flavors of a rich oolong.

[Tead Off]

I would not call smokiness umami, or the scent of compost or damp forest floor umami; but sometimes that has these things, umami is present. I am here using umami in the sense of a savory flavor that is very strongly present in preserved meats like ham or salame, in some cheeses like parmesan or a really aged gouda or cheddar, the deep background flavor of soy sauce, and that people like to add via such things as bottles of MSG or 'liquid smoke'. And I get some of that in some young sheng puerhs, and to a lesser extent, sometimes it is there as a backdrop to the lighter flavors of a rich oolong.

I guess it's possible. I haven't had that experience. I think I would wonder about my oolong if I tasted umami in them. But, again, umami is the 'predominant' taste in Japanese steamed teas, not a background flavor. That deep, pervading flavor that rests on your tongue. Unmistakable.