What am I tasting?

[DBentz]

I am confident about: "complex, vegetal, spinach, aspargas, grassy, sweet, and bitter". Whereas "astringent" and "umame" I think I recognize but not really sure. More to the point though, could some knowledgeable person explain what it is I taste in Yabe Supreme (Yuuki-cha), Kagoshima Sencha Saemidori (Yuuki-cha), and Uji Gyokuro Gokou (Yuuki-cha) that I don't taste in Asahina Gyokuro Yabukita (Yuuki-cha) or Uji Sencha Miyabi (O-cha)? Whatever flavor it is, it is particularly strong in the Yabe Supreme. I don't see a correlation between the depth of steam, variety of bush, or cultivation practice. Am I missing one? Also, what on earth is going on when I crack the lid on a preheated kyushu with dry Yabe Supreme leaves in it? I can get people who don't even like tea never mind Japanese green tea, to swoon when they smell that. Thanks in advance for anyone taking the time to try to address my ignorance on these points

[Chip]

Welcome to TeaChat.

Could be the varietals. The 3 you mention are "gyokuro" type varietals. The others are Yabukita which is THE sencha varietal. Yabukita usually lacks the deep gyo like flavor profile of Gokou and Saemidori vaietals.

One thing I do each time I brew sencha (or gyo), I smell the dry leaves after they are placed in the preheated kyusu. This can be a need to sit experience to a newbie. Yutaka Midori from O-Cha is my fave for this! Miyabi is also excellent.

Oh, astringent is more a sensation than a taste. It can be a dry mouth feeling that is common in many sencha.

Umami, this is more complicated. Earthy savoriness like mushrooms is one example. Umami is likley present but not dominating most Japanese teas. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umami

[DBentz]

Thanks so much for the explanation. Sounds like I may have a distinct preference for the gyokuro varietals then. Although I'm a little confused by a description I see of Asahina Gyokuro that says it is the Yabukita variety of tea bush. I suppose a varietal's classification as a sencha or gyokuro is more a general, than hard and fast rule. Also, for such an intense flavor I would expect some kind of generic description rather than one depending upon familiarity with the specific flavor profile of Gyokuro tea. But then again, I wouldn't hesitate to describe that specific flavor as unique. Guess I should revisit the Yutaka Midori and Miyabi again since just recently having discovered the virtues of a high iron content unglazed kyushu, my brewing skills have undoubtedly improved since then. Again, thanks so much Chip.

[AdamMY]

Thanks so much for the explanation. Sounds like I may have a distinct preference for the gyokuro varietals then. Although I'm a little confused by a description I see of Asahina Gyokuro that says it is the Yabukita variety of tea bush. I suppose a varietal's classification as a sencha or gyokuro is more a general, than hard and fast rule. Also, for such an intense flavor I would expect some kind of generic description rather than one depending upon familiarity with the specific flavor profile of Gyokuro tea. But then again, I wouldn't hesitate to describe that specific flavor as unique. Guess I should revisit the Yutaka Midori and Miyabi again since just recently having discovered the virtues of a high iron content unglazed kyushu, my brewing skills have undoubtedly improved since then. Again, thanks so much Chip.

I think a lot of people are confused by varietal = type of tea after processing. But in the end the varietal of the tea bush says more about for what growing conditions it may be best suited. While many types of tea are also the name of a variety of the tea bush from which it is usually made, the processing determines what the end product actually is.

For example you can have White and green Assam teas, just as you can use any of the Japanese tea varietals and make black tea. The big question is, is it at the end of the processing something people want to drink?

[Chip]

Yes, agreed.

For instance, Saemidori is a so called "natural gyokuro" varietal, but it is rarely processed into a gyokuro. It is processed as a sencha that mimics gyokuro flavor.

Gokou is a varietal that is usually processed into a gyokuro, but there are sencha examples that also have some gyo character.

Yabukita is usually processed into a sencha, but as we see, it can be processed into a gyokuro although it may even then lean towards sencha characteristics.

Varietals add a lot of variety to our sencha enjoyment.

[Catfur]

Umami is the taste of soy sauce, fish sauce, anchovies, or steak...

[Stentor]

Oh, astringent is more a sensation than a taste. It can be a dry mouth feeling that is common in many sencha.

Astringency is a sort of puckering sensation in your mouth, a "dry mouth feeling", like Chip said. I'm sure you know it now.

As for umami, I'm still trying to find out myself. I must have tasted it a thousand times since I primarily drink Japanese green tea. However, I still have a problem going "Ah, this tea has a lot of umami!" when I take a sip. It's probably one of the tastes I find to be unique to Japanese green tea but can't put a name to other than "sencha taste"

Umami, this is more complicated. Earthy savoriness like mushrooms is one example. Umami is likley present but not dominating most Japanese teas. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umami

Umami is the taste of soy sauce, fish sauce, anchovies, or steak...

Thanks for narrowing it down. I am more convinced now that what in another thread I described as "spinach and salmon" taste (in a fukamushi sencha) and suspected to be umami is indeed umami.

Since you brought up Sae Midori. It has umami too, right? I think it has a strong carrots, sweet potatoes and spinach taste. (I'm talking about Sae Midori Sencha from O-Cha specifically).

Varietals add a lot of variety to our sencha enjoyment.

LOL, you just couldn't resist, could you? Nicely put, Chip.

[grimbasement]

Just going to pipe in with what I've come to discover is my definition of unami. The way I've come to understand it is a taste that I taste in the area between the roof of the mouth and the back of the tongue kind of around the tonsil area. It's not really sweet but it is a taste that has viscosity to it... one other food that I've really tasted unami is steamed artichoke hearts. I've found that one can really accentuate the unami flavor by having a few sips of ice water after drinking a good japanese sencha. You'll likely feel the flavor coating the area I mentioned. Anyone else understand unami in this way?

ETA I really do have more than 1 post my account it's just I haven't posted since the site blew up some accounts about a year ago.