That was a really nice-looking cup! =)Jumpmonkey wrote: Found a spiffy cup (right size even) on Etsy for cheap as well.
https://www.etsy.com/transaction/81864482
May 21st, '12, 15:15
Posts: 375
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Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
Sriracha,
Thanks, I'm looking forward to getting it. I was shocked to find such a nice piece at that price.
Blairswhitaker,
Thank you for the input. I've actually found myself quite naturally beginning to use a cooling vessel.
Everyone,
Got the 100ml teapot in today. I laughed like a fool when I unpacked it. I thought it might be a joke for a second there. It looks more like a curio an actual teapot (as I am familiar with them.) I put a bit of silver-needle in. Four steeps in and I'm very happy. This thing is the perfect size. Thanks for everyone's help.
God bless,
Adam
Thanks, I'm looking forward to getting it. I was shocked to find such a nice piece at that price.
Blairswhitaker,
Thank you for the input. I've actually found myself quite naturally beginning to use a cooling vessel.
Everyone,
Got the 100ml teapot in today. I laughed like a fool when I unpacked it. I thought it might be a joke for a second there. It looks more like a curio an actual teapot (as I am familiar with them.) I put a bit of silver-needle in. Four steeps in and I'm very happy. This thing is the perfect size. Thanks for everyone's help.
God bless,
Adam
Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
Unfortunately, I have no advice to contribute here, but I was interested in some of the points people made in debating between electric and stovetop kettles. I'm searching for a new kettle myself, and I think I will end up with an electric kettle mostly for convenience sake. However, I've also had the very same issue that Adam speaks of: I feel like the water cools too much between steepings. I was under the impression that (and this is mostly a mix of hearsay and old wives tales) the reason for this had something to do with how fast the water was heating up so that the quicker the water boiled, the quicker the water would cool down again. The classic example of this is when someone tries to bowl water in a microwave (don't worry, I have never done that for any of my tea drinking), and while it may be piping hot the moment you take it out, it quickly cools off. I'm sure there are more confounding factors, such as the fact that people usually only boil smaller amounts in such rapid conditions, but I always thought there was some truth to this claim.
As a personal solution to this problem, I have been using an stainless steel electric kettle which seems to retain heat better the the cheap plastic one (grimace, I know) that I had in the dorms. Also, I have been getting in the habit of only boiling enough water for one, or at most two, steeps at a time. I boil fresh water after using the initial amounts. Again, I may be doing this due to faulty knowledge. I have been under the impression that once water boils it is, as some of the ancient tea masters put it, "dead" water and shouldn't be re-boiled. If you do re-boil the same water, it becomes flat and loses some of its taste, and is not fit to steep tea with. Because of that, I'm a more than hesitant to get a kettle or heater that keeps the the water hot through a continually boil. Instead, I prefer a kettle that retains heat through being a conductive material, such as stainless steel or cast iron.
Does anyone know if there is any support for these ideas? Or have I been working with half-cobbled together concepts?
As a personal solution to this problem, I have been using an stainless steel electric kettle which seems to retain heat better the the cheap plastic one (grimace, I know) that I had in the dorms. Also, I have been getting in the habit of only boiling enough water for one, or at most two, steeps at a time. I boil fresh water after using the initial amounts. Again, I may be doing this due to faulty knowledge. I have been under the impression that once water boils it is, as some of the ancient tea masters put it, "dead" water and shouldn't be re-boiled. If you do re-boil the same water, it becomes flat and loses some of its taste, and is not fit to steep tea with. Because of that, I'm a more than hesitant to get a kettle or heater that keeps the the water hot through a continually boil. Instead, I prefer a kettle that retains heat through being a conductive material, such as stainless steel or cast iron.
Does anyone know if there is any support for these ideas? Or have I been working with half-cobbled together concepts?
May 22nd, '12, 09:39
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Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
... some of this depends on what kind of tea you are brewing. If it is a green tea, and your steeps are small enough (takes longer to drink reallly big steeps and can be a waste of tea leaves too), I boil the electric kettle once, and it stays hot enough to do 4-5 steeps. This is partly due to the hidden heating element retaining heat I am sure.
Obviously if I need hotter water for oolong, black, pu-erh, I easily reheat, but usually not full boiling again.
Once the water and the kettle is boiling in an electric kettle which is actually faster than a microwave ... it does not cool any faster than water that is heated slowly.
Obviously if I need hotter water for oolong, black, pu-erh, I easily reheat, but usually not full boiling again.
Once the water and the kettle is boiling in an electric kettle which is actually faster than a microwave ... it does not cool any faster than water that is heated slowly.
Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
After posting, I was thinking about it more, and the idea that "the faster water boils, the faster it cools" seems utter nonsense. As you point out, electric kettles heat faster. Also, as I looked into it, microwaves cannot actual boil water (it only super-heats) unless you have something to break the surface tension. So I think the conductivity of the kettle matters more than anything.
However, to what you were saying Chip, I use an approximately 3oz gaiwan for pretty much all my teas at this point. I don't use a thermometer, but I do follow the "5 stages of boiling" as well as I can. This morning I had a nice green tea, which I steeped 6 times using 3 separate "shrimp eye" boils. The first boil I used twice - first to rinse and heat the gaiwan and cups, then for the actual first steep. The second boil I used for the following three steeps. And the final boil I used for the final two steeps.
What I worry about with using the same boil with all six steeping and the initial rinsing is that some cooling (even if minimal) will occur by the fifth or sixth steeping, and those last steepings are the ones that actually need, not only more time, but (slightly) more heat than the first steepings.
However, to what you were saying Chip, I use an approximately 3oz gaiwan for pretty much all my teas at this point. I don't use a thermometer, but I do follow the "5 stages of boiling" as well as I can. This morning I had a nice green tea, which I steeped 6 times using 3 separate "shrimp eye" boils. The first boil I used twice - first to rinse and heat the gaiwan and cups, then for the actual first steep. The second boil I used for the following three steeps. And the final boil I used for the final two steeps.
What I worry about with using the same boil with all six steeping and the initial rinsing is that some cooling (even if minimal) will occur by the fifth or sixth steeping, and those last steepings are the ones that actually need, not only more time, but (slightly) more heat than the first steepings.
Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
About boiling water and cooling times,
The idea that the quicker water is boiled the quicker it cools is an interesting thought. I have a feeling if you took 2 containers of the same type, containing the same amount of water, each heated to the same temperature, but having reached it at differing rates of speed, you'd discover that they would cool off in the same amount of time.
What may give some credence, or rather, offer explanation for the misconception would have to do with conductivity. A kettle made of a more conductive material will heat more quickly. But that same conductivity which allowed the water to reach boil rapidly, will also allow it to cool off quickly.
Thus, water boiled in a cheap metal kettle will boil quickly, but loose heat quickly. Water boiled in a clay kettle will heat more slowly, but also retain its heat longer. If you could (it is at best wasteful, at worst unsafe) boil water in a vacuum sealed thermos, it would take forever to do, but, as we know, it also retains the heat forever.
Be well and God bless,
Adam
The idea that the quicker water is boiled the quicker it cools is an interesting thought. I have a feeling if you took 2 containers of the same type, containing the same amount of water, each heated to the same temperature, but having reached it at differing rates of speed, you'd discover that they would cool off in the same amount of time.
What may give some credence, or rather, offer explanation for the misconception would have to do with conductivity. A kettle made of a more conductive material will heat more quickly. But that same conductivity which allowed the water to reach boil rapidly, will also allow it to cool off quickly.
Thus, water boiled in a cheap metal kettle will boil quickly, but loose heat quickly. Water boiled in a clay kettle will heat more slowly, but also retain its heat longer. If you could (it is at best wasteful, at worst unsafe) boil water in a vacuum sealed thermos, it would take forever to do, but, as we know, it also retains the heat forever.
Be well and God bless,
Adam
Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
Good Evening, Jumpmonkey
Following your reasoning, the ideal solution to the boiling problem
would be a non/low heat conductive container as a kettle, but fitted
with its own heating coil or element inside.
Perhaps Adagio could commission a Thermos Bottle company (stanley?) to design a two walled kettle with an insulated lid. Do not forget the Air Vent... . This kettle could be fitted with a heating element on the inside.
An additional temperature control would be nice.
The kettle should hold at least 1.6 Litres and be fitted with a replacable silver cleansing element to improve water quality (as found in air purifiers). Other purifying agents (ceramics etc) welcome ... .
I for my part, am prepared to spend a lot of money on something like this
Best Regards
Patrick B. Ludwig
Following your reasoning, the ideal solution to the boiling problem
would be a non/low heat conductive container as a kettle, but fitted
with its own heating coil or element inside.
Perhaps Adagio could commission a Thermos Bottle company (stanley?) to design a two walled kettle with an insulated lid. Do not forget the Air Vent... . This kettle could be fitted with a heating element on the inside.
An additional temperature control would be nice.
The kettle should hold at least 1.6 Litres and be fitted with a replacable silver cleansing element to improve water quality (as found in air purifiers). Other purifying agents (ceramics etc) welcome ... .
I for my part, am prepared to spend a lot of money on something like this
Best Regards
Patrick B. Ludwig
Re: New to looseleaf, choosing the right tools.
Ludwig,
I believe someone had already suggested heating (through whatever method) and then using a thermos/insulated container to store the heated water. I know it is not as ideal as design meant for proper pouring, but it'll hold the heat. You could use one of those fancy electric gismo's that shoots hot water, and bam you're good to go. Not as nice as a one-piece purpose-built electric, insulated kettle.
Take Care,
Adam
I believe someone had already suggested heating (through whatever method) and then using a thermos/insulated container to store the heated water. I know it is not as ideal as design meant for proper pouring, but it'll hold the heat. You could use one of those fancy electric gismo's that shoots hot water, and bam you're good to go. Not as nice as a one-piece purpose-built electric, insulated kettle.
Take Care,
Adam