Beginner/Cheap Yixing teapot

[MarshalN]

I'm not sure why anyone thinks teapots that have survived for over 130 years should be priced in a range that can be called "reasonable", especially if lots of people want them. If they're too expensive for you, well, either make more money or buy alternatives. We make these choices every day.

[Tead Off]

I'm not sure why anyone thinks teapots that have survived for over 130 years should be priced in a range that can be called "reasonable", especially if lots of people want them. If they're too expensive for you, well, either make more money or buy alternatives. We make these choices every day.

Market dynamics is a complex subject. Because we're talking specifically about Chinese culture and dynamics, bubble effects enter the picture just like anywhere else. The increased demand also increases the greed factor which cannot really be measured. Reasonable is a relative term and very subjective. But, I'm happy with what I've got and don't feel any lack of not having Qing period pots.

[the_economist]

Because we're talking specifically about Chinese culture and dynamics, bubble effects enter the picture just like anywhere else. The increased demand also increases the greed factor which cannot really be measured.

You use 'specifically' and 'everywhere else' in the same line to describe the same phenomenon. Perhaps there's nothing all that 'specific' about human behavior desiring things that other people consider good? Is it that you somehow intuitively understand this fact but you are unable to muster the necessary words to express it properly? Or, I'm curious now, do you just honestly think that greed and "bubbles" are somehow Chinese/racial things? Just imagine your statements replacing 'Chinese' with 'Jewish' or 'Black'.

[the_economist]

I'm not sure why anyone thinks teapots that have survived for over 130 years should be priced in a range that can be called "reasonable", especially if lots of people want them. If they're too expensive for you, well, either make more money or buy alternatives. We make these choices every day.

Sound economics

[kyarazen]

Sound economics

on the contrary there's something dissonant about a concept where by whatever that's expensive is more real than something cheap.

wonder if any tea chatters actually drink their tea out of some real ku ching chou or chu ker shin pots

[theredbaron]

Sound economics

on the contrary there's something dissonant about a concept where by whatever that's expensive is more real than something cheap.

Price is driven by demand. Good older pots are expensive, and getting more so because the demand has increased, and unless a huge hidden cache of older pots is found, the supply will only decrease. Which will only make the price go up further.

But - they are the best vessels to brew Chinese tea in, regardless of value. There were great when you could get them a lot cheaper, and still are as great today. Just because they are expensive and more difficult to obtain does not make them overrated or "more real". Some of my pots i got quite cheap compared to today's prices (and some i was even given as a present) - they were as "real" and dear to me then as they are now.

[Tead Off]

Because we're talking specifically about Chinese culture and dynamics, bubble effects enter the picture just like anywhere else. The increased demand also increases the greed factor which cannot really be measured.

You use 'specifically' and 'everywhere else' in the same line to describe the same phenomenon. Perhaps there's nothing all that 'specific' about human behavior desiring things that other people consider good? Is it that you somehow intuitively understand this fact but you are unable to muster the necessary words to express it properly? Or, I'm curious now, do you just honestly think that greed and "bubbles" are somehow Chinese/racial things? Just imagine your statements replacing 'Chinese' with 'Jewish' or 'Black'.

I'm afraid you're misinterpreting what I said. Of course I don't think those things are specifically Chinese. It's even absurd to imply it. I really don't know why you even thought that. We are talking about a Chinese cultural phenomenon involving teapots, not the Ukranians, Israelis, or Kenyans. Why does this bend you out of shape?

[debunix]

they are the best vessels to brew Chinese tea in, regardless of value

I get irritated when 'best' gets tossed out there like this. They are excellent vessels for brewing tea in, time-tested for sure, and the best are graceful and sturdy at the same time, but there are such a variety of clays all over the world that it's just silly to assume that there are no other combinations of clay and potter out there that could ever be as good.

(written while gazing fondly at my Petr Novak treebark pot, which is patiently waiting for me to finish a session with a nice dark toasty TGY)

[the_economist]

I agree, it's absurd to imply it, so why do you? Is it your lack of linguistic prowess? Here's your statement again, just in case your memory fails you:

The Chinese love to rush out and buy what they are told are treasures. You see it with all the brands, wine, cars, watches, etc. It's a way to impress others.

There is nothing specifically cultural about 'greed' or 'fads'. I do hope you understand that. There is nothing especially 'Chinese' about people buying things for showing off. I do hope you understand that too.

You could have avoided all this by saying:
"People love to rush out and buy what they are told are treasures."

But you decided, in your boundless wisdom, to imply it's the Chinese that especially behave in this way.

[ole]

I walked into a tattoo shop with a sign saying "Good tattoos isn't cheap, and cheap tattoos isn't good.", maybe this mantra should be adopted for yixing as well.

[Hannah]

"Cheap" and "Good" when it comes to yixing and often mutually exclusive I think

Best thing I ever did was buy my first yixing from a reputable seller here I found on teachat, expensive - certainly not cheap (as it was handmade), but it instantly gave me a ballpark for what I could expect from good yixing, and now I know the difference when brewing tea in cheaper pots.

Don't get me wrong, I've picked up some real gems quite cheap! But those were more flukes and luck than anything.
It's like buying a decent car - buy something mid-range (doesnt have to be hugely expensive, but not cheap either) that you know is coming from a good seller and will be reliable. You may have spent more money, BUT, at least you didn't buy a cheap lemon which doesn't do anything for you and needs fixing/replacing (which can often end up being more than what you would have paid if you bought the nicer car).

A terrible analogy perhaps, but I think you will understand
My first yixing was $240, and I stuck with it a long time (still watching that patina build!) and enjoying every cup - meanwhile, I know people who have tried to pickup $20-40 pots from ebay, bought things that often made the tea worse, and ended up racking up more than my $240.

All that said - nice yixing can be found under what I paid - so long as you know you're buying from a good seller

Sorry, went on a bit of a tangent there.. I'm currently at work procrastinating because I hate filling out my timesheets.

[theredbaron]

they are the best vessels to brew Chinese tea in, regardless of value

I get irritated when 'best' gets tossed out there like this. They are excellent vessels for brewing tea in, time-tested for sure, and the best are graceful and sturdy at the same time, but there are such a variety of clays all over the world that it's just silly to assume that there are no other combinations of clay and potter out there that could ever be as good.

(written while gazing fondly at my Petr Novak treebark pot, which is patiently waiting for me to finish a session with a nice dark toasty TGY)

You may also want to add that Yixing pots and clay in relation to it's effects on tea are also scientifically the most studied as well. Also China has many other clays, yet Yixing pots have been the most favored since they were first made.
It may irritate you even further, but just as the west has unparallelled heights of art, craft and philosophy, so has the east. Tea and tea-equipment is one such aspect. Mastery in such is not just reached by instant individual effort, but over generations of collected knowledge, skill and wisdom.
While now global trade, relatively pain-free and easy travel opportunities and the internet give quicker access to different cultures than ever before, it still does not mean that mastery of such subjects are any easier or quicker.

Therefore i find it rather irritating when Yixing pots are labeled and dismissed as "overrated" based on very little direct exposure to Chinese tea culture - while *all* the people i know who have their entire lives dedicated to the study of tea say otherwise.


Which doesn't mean to say that you cannot have great tea experiences when brewing in other vessels, lacking access to good yixing pots, or lacking funds. One of my best tea experiences, for example, was on a farm in the Wuyi mountains, drinking with a farmer his own tea, brewed with local water in a cheap gaiwan. Or, without skill and experience no great Yixing pot will automatically brew great tea. One does not need a good Yixing pot, but having one or more is a great advantage.

[kyarazen]

mind sharing a picture of your handmade yixing pot?

i do use something like a $20 yixing pot for tea sometimes.. and a couple of my main usage shuipings are $100+ there abouts.

"Cheap" and "Good" when it comes to yixing and often mutually exclusive I think

Best thing I ever did was buy my first yixing from a reputable seller here I found on teachat, expensive - certainly not cheap (as it was handmade), but it instantly gave me a ballpark for what I could expect from good yixing, and now I know the difference when brewing tea in cheaper pots.

Don't get me wrong, I've picked up some real gems quite cheap! But those were more flukes and luck than anything.
It's like buying a decent car - buy something mid-range (doesnt have to be hugely expensive, but not cheap either) that you know is coming from a good seller and will be reliable. You may have spent more money, BUT, at least you didn't buy a cheap lemon which doesn't do anything for you and needs fixing/replacing (which can often end up being more than what you would have paid if you bought the nicer car).

A terrible analogy perhaps, but I think you will understand
My first yixing was $240, and I stuck with it a long time (still watching that patina build!) and enjoying every cup - meanwhile, I know people who have tried to pickup $20-40 pots from ebay, bought things that often made the tea worse, and ended up racking up more than my $240.

All that said - nice yixing can be found under what I paid - so long as you know you're buying from a good seller

Sorry, went on a bit of a tangent there.. I'm currently at work procrastinating because I hate filling out my timesheets.