Mar 8th, '16, 04:46
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by lvwen » Mar 8th, '16, 04:46

steanze wrote:
lvwen wrote: Please don't be. I will cheer you up with some statistics. It is said Yixing zisha material formed about 200-400 million years ago of Lacustrine sedimentary and marine sedimentary deposits . Up to now, there are 102 mines of various zisha material in the vicinity of Yixing. Proven reserve of zisha material is about 73 million tons, available reserve is about 65 million tons. From Ming Dynasty(1368-1644) until now, only a fraction of zisha material has been used.
Let us do some calculation. We presume a kilo of zisha material can produce 2 200 cc zisha teapots( minus losses during mining and grinding), the proven reserve can make 146 billion 200 cc teapots from now on. :D
Thanks for the statistics and for teaching us more about Yixing! One thing I am curious about is how much of that clay is so-so zini, and how much of it is better clay.

If there is so much excellent clay that is easily available, I am trying to understand why I can't easily find on the market pots made of hongni with the quality of 1960s-70s Factory 1 hongni (smooth, fine grained texture, picks up patina quickly, the tea tastes crisp) for a cheap price. It is also a bit strange that Factory 1 would switch to lower quality hongni after the 1980s, if there was still so much of the better hongni left... And why there isn't more 茄子泥 or Factory 1 benshanlvni? I think that people would buy them if they were produced... Maybe I did not look in the right places. If you could find pots with clay like 60s-70s F1 hongni or 茄子泥 and sell them for a good price (say under $200) I would most likely get some, and you would probably make many of us here happy :D

Now F1 pots from the 60s-70s are expensive, and I think the pots on your website are very reasonably priced :) I think the pots you offer are better than most other vendors available to the western market so do not take this as a criticism :) I can find several of them on taobao (I posted some links earlier in this thread) and your price is very reasonable given that it's easier to buy on Ebay for western buyers - otherwise we'd have to pay for taobao agent fees and higher shipping costs. I myself have a couple of 李小璐 pots that I got a few years ago, when they costed about 180 yuan, and they are quite nice, but they are not close to 60s-70s F1 hongni. There are indeed some modern pots with pretty good clay (I personally like 蒋翔宇 and 许跃峰), but usually they are not very cheap, and they still are quite different from the earlier clays...
You had a very good question there and it is beyond my knowledge. I contacted Wang Xixi, who is the granddaughter of Wang Yichun, who was once manager of Factory 1. She said in 60s-70s, the factory was owned by the state. As you all may well know, at that time, people in China could barely had their belly full. So zisha teapot was not as sought after as these days. They used the best of the best Huanglongshan material to make teapots, as they had ample time to refine the material. In the 80s, however, after the open up policy, the Taiwanese came in, they bought teapots in large quantity. Because of the huge demand, less than best material was used to meet the demand. That is the reason why F1 switched to lower quality material.
There is still best of the best material, but the price has soured since then. A teapot made from material similiar to the 60s-70s is very expensive these days. Wang Xixi's mother makes teapots using the clay, at about 4000-5000 dollars a piece.
She said those 60-70s teapots on sale in China are 99% fake if not from reliable sources. :(

Mar 8th, '16, 08:44
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by steanze » Mar 8th, '16, 08:44

Thanks a lot Ivwen, I really appreciate that you asked Wang Xixi, it is wonderful to have information about a delicate topic like Yixing from such a reliable source! Yes, I am aware of the terrible history of poverty during the 60s and 70s. And you are right, most of the pots claimed to be from the 60s and 70s are fake... 99% seems like a reasonable figure :)
Now it makes sense, I hoped it would be easier to find such clay. However, the good thing is that there are less expensive modern clays that still perform very well. I wonder how expensive the raw clay used by Wang Xixi's mother is, and whether it would be possible to get some of that clay to make small gongfu pots with good but simple workmanship... I don't want to sidetrack this topic too much for my personal use, so if you have more information about this it would be great if you could pm me.

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Mar 8th, '16, 14:57
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by Frisbeehead » Mar 8th, '16, 14:57

Thanks for all the insight Ivwen, this has all been very informative. I have been keeping up with the updates to this thread in an effort to try to learn just a little bit more about Yixing teapots.

I am actually studying the Great Leap and Cultural Revolution right now. I'm almost finished with the book Mao's War Against Nature by Judith Shapiro, and she mentions how tea fields were affected in this time period. However, while she does talk about industry a bit, she doesn't touch on the Yixing teapot factories (or any consumer goods, for that matter). Regardless it is certainly an interesting time period that has had significant lasting effects on China today, including reaching into the production of Yixing teapots. Fascinating stuff!

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Mar 11th, '16, 00:37
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by bagua7 » Mar 11th, '16, 00:37

theredbaron wrote:There are nowadays quite a few fakes and imitations around, though i was told by a local collector that they are not too difficult to spot as they exact knowledge of the process of polishing has been lost. I don't dare to go into that as pots that are small enough and in a condition to actually use are very rare and very very expensive. Lots of these pots have been bought in the 90's by Malaysian collectors. You can see quite a few of them as show pieces in Chinese shops here, but they mostly are heirlooms not for sale.
Is the following eBay listed pot one of those you are talking about?

Antique Chinese Yixing Zisha Purple Clay "Zhuni' Pottery Teapot Signed. Republic

Too cheap? So that would make it a good candidate for a replica.

Mar 11th, '16, 01:33
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by steanze » Mar 11th, '16, 01:33

bagua7 wrote: Is the following eBay listed pot one of those you are talking about?

Antique Chinese Yixing Zisha Purple Clay "Zhuni' Pottery Teapot Signed. Republic

Too cheap? So that would make it a good candidate for a replica.
No, the ebay pot you linked is very fake but it's not trying to imitate the polished pots. This one is :)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Chinese ... Swxp9W2wTV

Mar 11th, '16, 01:46
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by theredbaron » Mar 11th, '16, 01:46

bagua7 wrote:
Is the following eBay listed pot one of those you are talking about?

Antique Chinese Yixing Zisha Purple Clay "Zhuni' Pottery Teapot Signed. Republic

Too cheap? So that would make it a good candidate for a replica.

Indeed, as steanze said

Mar 27th, '16, 08:27
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by lvwen » Mar 27th, '16, 08:27

It seems to me that it will take me some time to get used to the new version of the teachat.
I just couldn't send a private message to kyrazen.
The dicaoqing material has been here for a few days. Please tell me your address, kyrazen.

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Mar 27th, '16, 14:59
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Re: These entry level Yixing pots look good to me!

by kyarazen » Mar 27th, '16, 14:59

hello!

i cannot send you a PM too.. can you email me at kyarazen @ gmail.com or can you provide an email address for me to send you my address?

also do let me know the total costs of the raw material and also the postage :)~

thankyou!

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