Heini...Another Quest

[needaTEAcher]

Oh, and I had an idea. Is it possible that "black sand" is actually black mud, but that has the sand/soil material mixed in? In which case, Tim, would it be the one closer to the camera that is the sand one, since it has some sparkle to it, perhaps the grains of "sand"?

Needateacher-looking back 43 posts. Do you still consider your first group of 3 yixings pictures in your first post heini?

Lol, yes, at least, the solo pot. The "Twin" are something else. The solo pot just won't photograph right, though. I took a bunch of photos last night, but I haven't posted yet (super busy). They all come out brownish, blueing, or just off. Partly because I have a super cheap camera, and I wonder if part of it is because the clay is colored with something (manganese?) and that is giving it a discoloration that MarshalN mentioned (reddish)???

I got one solid photo that reflects the actual color. I'll post that one soon. Ultimately, I spent a good bit of time with it, looking at it up close, comparing it with my purple pots, and it is definitely not zini, at least not zini I've seen, and it is in line with heini I've seen. WIsh I could just pop over and show it too you. Gonne be in Korea this week?

[brandon]

Start by turning off the flash. Shoot next to something white so you can correct the white balance.

[MarshalN]

and that is giving it a discoloration that MarshalN mentioned (reddish)???

Please reread what I said, because I never said it's a discoloration that is caused by coloring agents.

[needaTEAcher]

I thought you wrote that artificially colored heini has a reddish tint (so we can tell if it is artificially colored by looking for red inside the black). What did you mean then, if not coloring agents (i.e. some kind of chemical, or mineral or some such)? Sorry to misquote. That's why I wrote it with a ?, since I was not 100% sure I understood it. I only thought I had it right.

[MarshalN]

Black pots that are not somehow artificially black actually seem to me to have a reddish base - not very obvious, but look closely and they seem to be slightly red underneath the black. I have two pots that are blackish, here's one of them.

http://www.marshaln.com/2007/12/saturda ... r-22-2007/

The pots you bought are very regular pots with pretty common clay. I'd suggest you should only buy them if it's a very good price.

Please read carefully before you quote others, and if in doubt, you can always go back and re-read, thank you.

[needaTEAcher]

Ahhhh, I flipped it. I sometimes do that. Good old fashioned learning disabilities on the attack!

Please don't take offense. I genuinely mean no harm. I just want to learn and enjoy teachat, which I think is true for many (most?!) of us.

[needaTEAcher]

I went on a photo spree, and I used my camera to shoot a whole range of heini pots. All but one came out brown! It was strange to look at the black pot, then look at the brown photo. Confirms that I am not crazy, and the camera really does suck! The only black pot I took that stayed black was a two-tone hongni pot. I took it to the owner to ask about it, and it turns out it is colored with ink! Looks like I found a magic camera that shows fake heini!

I am going to open another thread about photo color and clay types at some point soon, whenever I get these photos sorted and sized. I just thought it was really interesting.

For now, here is a shot of my heini pot with the white balance adjusting for the indoor lighting, and a sunlit shot of the chop. Still not right though. You can see the blue tint in the counter. But these photos are the closest yet to the color in real life.

[ImmortaliTEA]

I went on a photo spree, and I used my camera to shoot a whole range of heini pots. All but one came out brown! It was strange to look at the black pot, then look at the brown photo. Confirms that I am not crazy, and the camera really does suck! The only black pot I took that stayed black was a two-tone hongni pot. I took it to the owner to ask about it, and it turns out it is colored with ink! Looks like I found a magic camera that shows fake heini!

I am going to open another thread about photo color and clay types at some point soon, whenever I get these photos sorted and sized. I just thought it was really interesting.

For now, here is a shot of my heini pot with the white balance adjusting for the indoor lighting, and a sunlit shot of the chop. Still not right though. You can see the blue tint in the counter. But these photos are the closest yet to the color in real life.

I'm not so sure that is Hei-Ni needaTEAcher! I can only go by my experience with different black clays that I have bought and to me this one's clay looks very similar to a few tuition black clay teapots I purchased off of eBay stores such as 5000 friends and other relatively inexpensive eBay dealers labeled as black zhuni which i have never seen and IF it is a real type of clay it would most likely be something very rare and expensive and most certainly not on eBay. All of these black teapots I bought seemed to have a distictly chemical smell from the jump and after smelling them post boiling rinse I was afraid to even drink tea out of them so ended up destroying them all as it wasn't worth risking when one knows never to drink out of a chemical smelling pot. The only pot that I ever bought that seemed closer and even possibly is real Hei Ni or at least has real Hei Ni mixed in is the 70 ml 1980's Hei Ni Three Footed Shui Ping that I posted as one of my first pots ever on the Yixing showoff thread. I'm not certain but it seems like every time I see a clay that is "supposed" to be real Hei Ni it is very dark (can even appear dark greyish black) but has extremely small white silica dots very similar to Lvni and these dots are much more apparent before the teapot has begun being used for brewing tea because since this is such a porous clay it absorbs quite a bit of tea oils quite fast and this changes the hue of the clay color itself into more of the shade of the tea oils themselves while covering up the small white dots with this layer of patina or oils. For example, my "Hei Ni" pot was covered with those beautiful white/silvery dots especially on the inside where they were extremely abundant and quite beautiful. However, after about a 9 months to a year of continuous aged Sheng puerh brewing in it, I was astounded to see that nearly every tiny dot had been completely covered up with tea oils and the entire general shade of the teapot's clay itself took on a slightly more dark reddish/amber/brownish aged puerh looking color. I am not saying that I am 100% sure but based on my experience that is what I have seen portrayed as the true Hei Ni and just my two cents!

[needaTEAcher]

Thanks Immortal. Great response. After some more research on my end, I think I can call this pot a heini zini mix, but more heini. I got it from a reputable source in KL, recommended by a teachatter actually, and I do trust him. But comparing it to these pots below, it looks just a touch brown. But compared to any other purple clay pot, even the ones I know are mixed (usually 70%zini 30% heini), it seems much, much darker. Maybe 90% heini/clay colored with manganese, 10% zini?

I will investigate for white spots tonight.

[needaTEAcher]

Just for fun, here is a pot I want so much. It sold out about 9 years ago.

10 years ago (or was it 8?) there was a public factory called (transcribed from Chinese to Korean to English, so sorry!) Kungjeongdopang. They closed, but this is one of the pots they put out. Great clay. All three pots are 100cc or less, and about 10 years old. I own the two in the back, and the one in the front belongs to a friend.

Anyone recognize this chop or the Large Acorn chop?

[MarshalN]

Just for fun, here is a pot I want so much. It sold out about 9 years ago.

10 years ago (or was it 8?) there was a public factory called (transcribed from Chinese to Korean to English, so sorry!) Kungjeongdopang. They closed, but this is one of the pots they put out. Great clay. All three pots are 100cc or less, and about 10 years old. I own the two in the back, and the one in the front belongs to a friend.

Anyone recognize this chop or the Large Acorn chop?

They're not closed, they're still in business as far as I can tell. The same place that makes pots that Stephane sells.

http://www.jdart.cn/

[needaTEAcher]

I thought they closed as a public factory and opened as a private. Anyone have more info?

[MarshalN]

I thought they closed as a public factory and opened as a private. Anyone have more info?

These guys were always private. Some of the artisans worked in the #1 and other places before.

[needaTEAcher]

Interesting. I have heard differently from people on the ground in Yixing that I trust. Can you offer any source materials? Do you know when they opened? I checked out the link, but haven't had time to try and figure out the English translations. Are you identifying the factory by the chops above or by the transliteration (it is from Chinese to Korean, and then I transliterated it myself into English....meaning the actual name could have easily been corrupted!).

I'm always curious to know more!

[brandon]

I think you are reading too much into (or being mislead) by your sources. A lot of potters are now operating in the space that was formerly Factory 1. Some of them worked there while it was state owned. To suggest that the brand above is some sort of continuum directly from a state owned factory, however, would be stretching the facts. To suggest the pots are a hot commodity because the brand no longer exists is patent falsification with motive. To be honest I have owned and seen some of their pots and they are nothing to get excited about, let alone write a historical thesis on.