The use of scales in brewing.

[Chip]

I would also propose that we all weigh leaf to a degree. We use our senses when we scoop leaf out of a bag. Our senses tell us...wow, that is heavy leaf per volume. Our mind acts to interpret our senses in a split second. We all weigh tea. It becomes part of our routine and we may not ven notice it after a while. But I believe this to be true.

Hate to quote my self, but I brought this up 2 pages ago.

All I can say is, a scale works for me today. I neither condemn nor condone its use or nonuse. I respect the choice of anyone to use or not to use.

Sometimes for me, it is just about brewing a damn good cup of tea, I can do this consistantly with a scale. I have expressed that I was not as able to do it without. The scale use improved my tea enjoyment and made it so much more consistant due to the varying densities of each tea.

I applaud Tenuki's abilities and always have. Clearly his methodology is best for him. I would no sooner suggest he stear his sail boat my way, than have him suggest how I should scale a mountain on my bicycle.

I simply suggest there is no single answer for everyone that Tenuki is ardently striving for...or so it seems. I am not here to be convinced my way is right or wrong, but I expect my way to be respected just as I respect others' ways.

Having said all this, I may put my scale in the back of a drawer and never get it out again. But that would be my choice.

[tenuki]

I simply suggest there is no single answer for everyone that Tenuki is ardently striving for...or so it seems.

Original premise #4 and numerous mentions of 'different goals, different people, different best'.

You aren't listening to me Chip. My intent with this conversation is to dispel the mystery we all feel when presented with another point of view. Things will stay mysterious if you refuse to listen.

Listening to other viewpoints doesn't need to be threatening.

[scruffmcgruff]

Listening to other viewpoints doesn't need to be threatening.

It just seems that, though you mention your acceptance of others' use of scales in passing, the vast majority of your posts have value-laden terms (like "one dimensional," and many others which I can comb up if you would like) which set up a strong polemic. If you were truly interested in what we have to say, you would not have started off with an argument for why we are wrong. And no, this is not an attempt to guilt trip you, it is just an attempt to show you why we continue to respond to you.

[Chip]

Listening to other viewpoints doesn't need to be threatening.

I could not agree more...

[Chip]

Listening to other viewpoints doesn't need to be threatening.

It just seems that, though you mention your acceptance of others' use of scales in passing, the vast majority of your posts have value-laden terms (like "one dimensional," and many others which I can comb up if you would like) which set up a strong polemic. If you were truly interested in what we have to say, you would not have started off with an argument for why we are wrong. And no, this is not an attempt to guilt trip you, it is just an attempt to show you why we continue to respond to you.

I was wrong...I agree more to this.

[Salsero]

Listening to other viewpoints doesn't need to be threatening.

[Space Samurai]

Yeah, Scruff said what I was going to, but only better and without using words like...well, you know me.

[CynTEAa]

Heated 'teascussion?'

[tenuki]

the vast majority of your posts have value-laden terms (like "one dimensional," and many others which I can comb up if you would like) which set up a strong polemic.

A strong polemic is nothing to be ashamed of where I come from. Thanks for the compliment.

Now, back to more productive matters:

Here is a second try at #3. I notice the word 'consistency' coming up a lot, and it is far less purjorative than my choices so here it goes.

3) Easily provides consistency and repeatability to brewing.

Thoughts? Did I get that right?

[tenuki]

the vast majority of your posts have value-laden terms (like "one dimensional," and many others which I can comb up if you would like) which set up a strong polemic.

Interestingly enough, the example you use is strange to me.

4g

So, that is a one dimensional measure, right? I mean, it's not 3g/s or anything like that... Are you disputing this? I wasn't prepared for a math theory class, but bring it on!

[scruffmcgruff]

Could you explain that a bit? Either it's more advanced than what I've learned in my few math courses, or something just went over my head. Also, I missed the relevance; where did that come from?

[tenuki]

Could you explain that a bit? Either it's more advanced than what I've learned in my few math courses, or something just went over my head. Also, I missed the relevance; where did that come from?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimension

one dimension would be weight

two dimension would be feet/second or speed

How is this not relevant, you said calling weight a one dimensional measurement was 'value laden'. I bet to differ, it is merely accurate.

Am I on a different planet than the rest of you or something?

[Chip]

5 grams sencha/200 ml water/168* (preheated kyusu)/90 sec

4 dimensions or 3 depending on point of view.

[tenuki]

5 grams sencha/200 ml water/168* (preheated kyusu)/90 sec

4 dimensions or 3 depending on point of view.

Interesting break down of the brewing process as a whole as 4 dimensions. You may be onto something here, a formula for brewing with the ability to change time and temp, grams, water and still get the same result? hmnnn.. In sailing performance measurement we call these polars, because they are plotted as lines on polar graph paper. I'll have to think this through some more, interesting.

I think there are probably 20 or more dimensions to my brewing, no wonder I suck at it and am confused most of the time. Maybe time to simplify. lol. (jk)

The scale deals with one question, ie 'how much'. It is a one dimension answer to that question. That was my point. My post elaborated on some of the other dimensions to that same question that are lost if you rely on a scale's answer.

[Chip]

I read all your posts.

Erase the board...

6 grams oolong/4ish oz water/temp(not going here)/time(not going here either)

The next dimension is steeps I suppose and how it affects/increases the volume of steeped leaves...this gets to be like 3 dimensional chess on ST. But I know through experience what will happen to 6 grams in this example of this particular oolong.

One still has to know his tea and how it reacts to time and steeps. It is not simply a linear model, nor an arbitrary figure guessed upon.

Experience...another dimension. Experience tells me what to expect from 6 grams of this particular oolong over the course of time and steeps.

Yes, a scale is a simplification of the model for my feeble mind...the X factor in all dimensions and variables. But I need to remember to breath and blink my eyes.

I can complicate this or simplify this to meet my needs on a particular moment...throw leaf in and brew...