Dragon Well

[Alex]

mmm 80-85c brewing...that sounds hot. What temps do people here go for for LJ?

I've been around 60-70c

[qaymar23]

Yes, both of these teas were less than 1/10th the price of Tim's top-rated LJs so it is unlikely that either is ultra quality. I am new to LJ, however I believe both of these teas are authentic.

I didn't mean they were not real LJ's, just that the Shi Feng is unlikely to be the real deal that is supposed to set Shi Feng apart from other LJ's.

No amount of skill in purchasing is going to get real Shi Feng for this price. It's a pipe dream. It's business.

What tea vendors would one purchase some of the higher quality Shi Feng from? thanks

I bought some premium Shi Feng from Hojo:-
http://hojotea.com/item_e/g06e.htm

Thread on it:-
http://www.teachat.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13805

You can contact them for online pricing (much cheaper than their shop price).

How was the Shi Feng from Hojo? Do you feel that it is superior or similiar to some of the less costly vendors? Actually I read the wonderful article Hojo posted and received their price list. It is approx. $64.00 USA per 25 grams or I quess about $2.50 per gram, of course that is not including shipping.

[auhckw]

Yes, both of these teas were less than 1/10th the price of Tim's top-rated LJs so it is unlikely that either is ultra quality. I am new to LJ, however I believe both of these teas are authentic.

I didn't mean they were not real LJ's, just that the Shi Feng is unlikely to be the real deal that is supposed to set Shi Feng apart from other LJ's.

No amount of skill in purchasing is going to get real Shi Feng for this price. It's a pipe dream. It's business.

What tea vendors would one purchase some of the higher quality Shi Feng from? thanks

I bought some premium Shi Feng from Hojo:-
http://hojotea.com/item_e/g06e.htm

Thread on it:-
http://www.teachat.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13805

You can contact them for online pricing (much cheaper than their shop price).

How was the Shi Feng from Hojo? Do you feel that it is superior or similiar to some of the less costly vendors? Actually I read the wonderful article Hojo posted and received their price list. It is approx. $64.00 USA per 25 grams or I quess about $2.50 per gram, of course that is not including shipping.

I recently tasted Mei Jia Wu Long Jing at a different tea shop. They have 5 diff grades. The best grade couldn't compete with Hojo's Shi Feng in terms of the aftertaste (sweetness) in the throat.

But for less expensive casual drink, I think I would purchase the Mei Jia too cause it is 1/2 the price of Hojo's Shi Feng.

[qaymar23]

recently tasted Mei Jia Wu Long Jing at a different tea shop. They have 5 diff grades. The best grade couldn't compete with Hojo's Shi Feng in terms of the aftertaste (sweetness) in the throat.

But for less expensive casual drink, I think I would purchase the Mei Jia too cause it is 1/2 the price of Hojo's Shi Feng.

I have recently purchased, but not yet received a couple of the more popular LJ from Jing Tea shop and also order a sample of Lotas Heart LJ from Imperial court, to get a good gauge of the different qualities of LJ. I have had a Mei Jia Wu LJ from Tea Trekker in the U.S, very nice, but I found myself really wanting to explore some of the better quality LJ available. Thank you for your take on Hojo's LJ and I believe I will have to order some before they run out.

[Tead Off]

How was the Shi Feng from Hojo? Do you feel that it is superior or similiar to some of the less costly vendors? Actually I read the wonderful article Hojo posted and received their price list. It is approx. $64.00 USA per 25 grams or I quess about $2.50 per gram, of course that is not including shipping.

This was approximately the price for Shi Feng I drank in Hong Kong. I have not had a better LJ, even the one from East Teas.

[qaymar23]

How was the Shi Feng from Hojo? Do you feel that it is superior or similiar to some of the less costly vendors? Actually I read the wonderful article Hojo posted and received their price list. It is approx. $64.00 USA per 25 grams or I quess about $2.50 per gram, of course that is not including shipping.

This was approximately the price for Shi Feng I drank in Hong Kong. I have not had a better LJ, even the one from East Teas.

Thank you Teadoff. I was going to order from East teas next but I believe I will have to order my next LJ from Hojo before they run out.

[qaymar23]

Thank you for the suggestion. Is East Teas also known as Postcard tea?

It is not exactly the same thing, but you'll find the Long Jing Tead Off is talking about at Postcardteas (here.) Tim works in both companies. Don't be afraid to ask him, he is a very cool fellow.

His shop is not often talked about but he has some very decent teas - I am very pleased with his wuyi yan cha - and each one of them comes with a exhaustive explanation on how, when or where it was grown, harvested, processed, which is IMO a very good thing.

thank you I thought that the Long Jing was the same. Yes, I really like the detailed explanations about the teas. I would rather purchase from a vendor who knows exactly where their teas come from and from who then a vendor who always uses a middleperson and depends on them for the quality of tea they sell in their establishment.

[Tead Off]

There seems to be a deep problem occurring in China where vendors only repeat what the growers or distributors tell them and not actually test the teas for pesticide residues. It has been pointed out to me that growers and distributors lie about organic farming and pass on these lies to the vendors who in turn pass on this information unknowingly to us, the consumers. I want to believe that somewhere in China there is organic farming going on but people tell me the certification can be bought outright without testing.

When teas are being sold for more than $100/100g and being billed as organic, can the farmer really not afford to have the teas tested if they want to sell to international vendors? Because the domestic demand is so high in China, why would most of these farmers bother to get certification if their teas are really organic? The Chinese themselves don't demand it. This is a problem I don't see an answer for and is very disconcerting for someone like myself who would prefer to drink organically grown teas. I really don't know what to think anymore about organic Chinese teas.

[The]

There seems to be a deep problem occurring in China where vendors only repeat what the growers or distributors tell them and not actually test the teas for pesticide residues. It has been pointed out to me that growers and distributors lie about organic farming and pass on these lies to the vendors who in turn pass on this information unknowingly to us, the consumers. I want to believe that somewhere in China there is organic farming going on but people tell me the certification can be bought outright without testing.

When teas are being sold for more than $100/100g and being billed as organic, can the farmer really not afford to have the teas tested if they want to sell to international vendors? Because the domestic demand is so high in China, why would most of these farmers bother to get certification if their teas are really organic? The Chinese themselves don't demand it. This is a problem I don't see an answer for and is very disconcerting for someone like myself who would prefer to drink organically grown teas. I really don't know what to think anymore about organic Chinese teas.

Thanks for sharing this disturbing information about the lacking of morality and control in chinese so called organic tea trade. I wonder if the morality is equal bad in Japan and japanese organic tea trading? I only buy realtively high-end organic greens and whites so this subject is indeed important to me! At e.g. http://jingtea.com/tea/green-tea/pre-ra ... -long-jing you see these two labels 'fair for life' and 'soil assciation standard organic but as you mention you don't know if theese organisations control the product themselves or just believe in what their e.g. chinese dealers tell them!

[Chip]

Thanks for sharing this disturbing information about the lacking of morality and control in chinese so called organic tea trade. I wonder if the morality is equal bad in Japan and japanese organic tea trading? I only buy realtively high-end organic greens and whites so this subject is indeed important to me! At e.g. http://jingtea.com/tea/green-tea/pre-ra ... -long-jing you see these two labels 'fair for life' and 'soil assciation standard organic but as you mention you don't know if theese organisations control the product themselves or just believe in what their e.g. chinese dealers tell them!

The more expensive a tea, the higher the motivating factors to basically commit fraud and even potentially harm end consumers in the process. It is seemingly much easier to do so in the Chinese tea marketing and distribution system that is largely hidden from the West.

The Japanese market is much more finite and controlled and definitely more transparent, at least that is the general conception. A Japanese vendor has too much to lose for a short term gain, and is much more likely to get caught, and if caught, they are likely pretty much done.

However everyone in the process has to remain vigilant.

[David R.]

The Japanese market is much more finite and controlled and definitely more transparent, at least that is the general conception. A Japanese vendor has too much to lose for a short term gain, and is much more likely to get caught, and if caught, they are likely pretty much done.

I have to agree on that. Chinese and japanese ways of conducting business are really different from my point of view. It's a cultural thing.

[entropyembrace]

Also it seems that inside Japan there is a fairly strong demand for organic products so they have motivation to create strong organic certification standards for their own benefit....but in China because of greater wealth inequality and the enormous pressure they are under to manufacture goods as cheaply as possible or lose their export business with the west most workers are paid very little and cannot afford organic products there does not seem to be so much internal demand and the main motivation for organic certification (which is expensive) becomes to get a higher price in the export market.

Though when you´re talking about artisan teas produced by teamasters who really care about maximizing quality it´s a different situation than tea plantations maximizing volume to fill teabags...The artist is not going to drench his work in toxic chemicals.

[gingkoseto]

I have to agree on that. Chinese and japanese ways of conducting business are really different from my point of view. It's a cultural thing.

Everyone can believe want she wants to. But I am sorry you have to think in this way. What's the cultural root of capitalistic greed?

[David R.]

I have to agree on that. Chinese and japanese ways of conducting business are really different from my point of view. It's a cultural thing.

Everyone can believe want she wants to. But I am sorry you have to think in this way. What's the cultural root of capitalistic greed?

My words may have been poorly chosen to state my mind. What I wanted to say was that I was more inclined to believe a japanese seller who would tell me that his product is a genuinely organic, because I know that when a japanese fellow put his word on the line, that means that his honour is at stake, which can be a pretty serious thing. I think that a chinese seller may have fewer reserves to tell you just what you want to ear in order to sell. But that doesn't mean that the japanese seller's margin won't be outrageous. And I know that there are exceptions too.

That being said, and I don't want to sound like I don't like chinese people. For me, both countries have different ways of conducting business. It doesn't mean that ones are better than others, but I think this is how things are done and have been for years. A different culture of commerce, but serving the same goal : profit.

But I don't want to open a debate. I hope you see what I meant now.

[bagua7]

I had a brew last night of a four-year-old LJ and oh boy! I can't imagine what would it be like when consumed fresh.

It was given to me by a Chinese merchant I know of where I live, it was purchased in China. He told me it was just medium quality.

I wonder now what's high quality like.

I need to travel to Beijing and ask my teacher's teacher who has good contacts with members of the ruling party.