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Jul 10th, '09, 01:15
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Brand new 100 year-old Shudei Kyusu for sale.

by tingjunkie » Jul 10th, '09, 01:15

Hmmm. Very intriguing indeed. This ebay store is selling "new" kyusu they claim have been in storage for 100 years. What do the experts think? If it is true, is it a good value?

http://stores.shop.ebay.com/The-Old-Tok ... ec0Q2em322

If only it was 100 year old Yixing for that price, huh?

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Jul 10th, '09, 01:24
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by Tead Off » Jul 10th, '09, 01:24

There are other good clays beside yixing clay. With a 100 year old Tokoname kyusu, you should be assured of getting pure clay with a high iron content. But, as others have said, it's not easy buying through photos. So much of a pot's personal appeal is through the feel of it in your hands and how it pours. Little details we don't see in photos are the make or break elements for me. It's a very subjective call.

But, then again, do you believe this seller? Everything else he has is new, commerical wares. The quality of the kyusu is not high. It's an ordinary piece mass produced. You can see this on the finishing. I'm not saying it is not 100 years of age, but, is it worth what he is asking for it?
Last edited by Tead Off on Jul 13th, '09, 07:33, edited 1 time in total.

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Jul 13th, '09, 04:02
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by Jack_teachat » Jul 13th, '09, 04:02

I love the shape and colour of that pot!

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by Chip » Jul 13th, '09, 09:59

This seller seems to have a bottomless pit with these pots. A few years ago they had a ton of them and they were dirt cheap. Now I am guessing they have fewer and fewer and thus the price has jumped dramatically.

The clay reminds me of clay flower pot clay, looks quite different from what is around these days. Not sure what to make of them. They also have a rough look to them.

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Jul 13th, '09, 16:22
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by Oni » Jul 13th, '09, 16:22

Those teapots are FAKES. Do not buy, I saw them advertise on youtube, the sell various knock offs claiming them vintage. Be warned this guy is a scamer. Just use your common sense, does that teapot look special or old to you?

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Jul 13th, '09, 16:30
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by Chip » Jul 13th, '09, 16:30

Hard to say, Oni, in black and white terms that this is a scam, though I too am suspect.

Thing is, it seems like there are huge warehouses with old teaware that has never been used, "perfect in mint." It is amazing actually.

I liken it to the vast warehouse in the first Indiana Jones movie at the very end. Treasures beyond our wildest imaginations.

It seems that the Japanese production continues beyond demand at times. The good news is that they do not do this with the tea they produce!!!!

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Jul 14th, '09, 01:29
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by Oni » Jul 14th, '09, 01:29

100 years of time should be visible either on the material or the shape, generally clay that has such an age should have diffrent color, at least old yixing teapots have unique colors, and a real one that is 100 years old would cost a lot more than 120 $. They look like some mold made kyusu, from clay that is used for flower pots, and I suspect they are not made in japan too, I have a strong instinct for scams.

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Jul 14th, '09, 01:32
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by Chip » Jul 14th, '09, 01:32

I agree they look like cheap flower pot clay.

Still the age could be true. They could have been sitting in a vast warehouse in boxes, etc.

Just sayin' ...
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Jul 14th, '09, 01:48
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by Tead Off » Jul 14th, '09, 01:48

Oni wrote:100 years of time should be visible either on the material or the shape, generally clay that has such an age should have diffrent color, at least old yixing teapots have unique colors, and a real one that is 100 years old would cost a lot more than 120 $. They look like some mold made kyusu, from clay that is used for flower pots, and I suspect they are not made in japan too, I have a strong instinct for scams.
Oni, I am an antiquities dealer for many years. I have seen every conceivable scam you can think of and still do. What I use photos for is to see the general quality of an item, its workmanship, condition, etc. Based on these photos, I would not want one of these pots. It's a commercially made pot that doesn't look like good Tokoname clay, high fired. This is enough to put me off. Based on the photos, I wouldn't conclude their age. I have seen many things that have fooled me when I finally got to see the actual object. Also, many things made for use in poor farmer villages are not going to be the quality that we see online or in antique galleries.

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by Domn » Jul 14th, '09, 10:07

Also, many things made for use in poor farmer villages are not going to be the quality that we see online or in antique galleries.
I must agree with this!

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by tingjunkie » Jul 14th, '09, 18:07

Domn wrote:
Also, many things made for use in poor farmer villages are not going to be the quality that we see online or in antique galleries.
I must agree with this!
I'm no expert by any means, but this was my take on the situation too. The pots may well be that old, but they look like cheap, mass-produced, 100 year old pots. I thought there was a chance that the clay would have been very pure given that age, but perhaps the age of the clay is not as important for Tokoname as it is for Yixing. All speculation, I really don't know much about this stuff yet!

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