What to do about Bitter Gyokuro

[JRS22]

I just posted this on the O-Cha Green Tea Forum, but I thought I would try also posting it here.

I decided it was time to learn about gyokuro, so I ordered a package of O-Cha Yame. It's moderately priced (for gyokuro) and received rave reviews, so it seemed like a good starting point. The website says this is 2009 tea and the package lists the expiration date as 2011/7/31. I've brewed it twice, and both times it's been bitter.

1st - I followed the instructions that came with the tea - 140 degrees for 2 minutes in a preheated kyusu, with 4 grams of tea for about 4 ounces of water.

2nd - 130 degrees for 1 minute in a room temperature kyusu, with the same ratio of tea to water. A little better but still bitter. I actually tried a bit at 40 seconds and it was a less bitter but very weak.

I know that partly this is my personal issue - that I'm overly sensitive to bitter tastes - but I'm hoping there's a way to brew this tea to bring out the sweetness and balance out the bitterness. I'm not sure what to try next - the usual advice for reducing bitterness is to lower the time & or the temperature - I already did both the second day. Is there a better way to brew this tea - Id' like to find a way to enjoy it enough to use it up -or is my only hope to try a different gyokuro?

[Chip]

Since you are relatively hypersensitive to bitterness, try 90 seconds ... also try even lower temp. I have had Yame that required much lower temps. You could also try less leaf. But I would try shorter steeping first, then lower temp, then less leaf in that order.

Unfortunately I did not have the 2009 Yame from O-Cha. When I did have it, I found it to be a very good value and beat anything gyo I had at that price point. But it is still pretty much entry level gyokuro. Stil I do not recall bitterness.

Another thing with gyokuro, you can set it aside for a while and come back to it. I have done this with positive results.

[JRS22]

Since you are relatively hypersensitive to bitterness, try 90 seconds ... also try even lower temp. I have had Yame that required much lower temps. You could also try less leaf. But I would try shorter steeping first, then lower temp, then less leaf in that order.

OK - so first the original temperature but shorter time, then if that doesn't work bring the time down even lower than 130 degrees. And get up really early in the morning so it's not too hot to drink tea!

Unfortunately I did not have the 2009 Yame from O-Cha. When I did have it, I found it to be a very good value and beat anything gyo I had at that price point. But it is still pretty much entry level gyokuro. Stil I do not recall bitterness.

So if I perceive bitterness where others don't, there's a possibility that if I was drinking a higher level gyokuro there might be less bitterness (where's that gyokuro OTTI?)

Another thing with gyokuro, you can set it aside for a while and come back to it. I have done this with positive results.

Where should I set it aside? Right now it's double wrapped and in the freezer.

[Chip]

OK - so first the original temperature but shorter time, then if that doesn't work bring the time down even lower than 130 degrees. And get up really early in the morning so it's not too hot to drink tea!

You should maybe check the calibration on that thermometer ... see that other forum.

So if I perceive bitterness where others don't, there's a possibility that if I was drinking a higher level gyokuro there might be less bitterness (where's that gyokuro OTTI?)

Bitterness is usually a sign of something amiss with one's brewing. You can make even the best ones bitter with water that is too hot.

Now there is just bad tasting gyo of low pedigre. I have had really foul tasting gyo, this definitely was not one of them. But this is not 56 $ Kame either.

Where should I set it aside? Right now it's double wrapped and in the freezer.

It is not likely to get better in the freezer. Keep it at room temp. Freshness is usually not an issue with gyo from a vendor such as O-Cha.

When I do cold store, I cold store at 33-35* F. Freezing can be problematic. Be careful when removing it in order to prevent condensation.

Still, I think you need to play with the parameters first. Gyo is a tricky animal at first til you get the hang of it.

[Oni]

The higher the quality of the gyokuro, the sweeter and less bitter it is, and specially Kuradashi gyokuro tends to be very sweet and mild, aromatic, so I recomend you to try some higher grade gyokuro, I had Jyoshu from Marukyu Koyamaen, that had a complete lack of bitterness, but to mild for my personal preference.

[Tead Off]

Normally, I follow the method that Ippodo recommends:

10g in an 80-100ml pot, 60C for 90sec.

Sometimes I use a bit less leaf, maybe 7-8g, but, using their Gyokuro, I have never had bitter tea.

The first Gyokuro I ever tried was a gift from someone just returning from Tokyo and it was so good that subsequent purchases from online vendors didn't come close until I tried Ippodo's Gyokuro. Start with Kanro, and, if you find this bitter then perhaps Japanese teas are not for you. I mention Ippodo because just about everyone that I have ever talked to about Japanese teas mentions them as a source of fine teas.

PS-I wouldn't keep any tea in the fridge once opened. The possibility of moisture and odor is great.

[Chip]

I never had Ippodo Gyokuro ... I should try it. I quite like the Kame (not to be confused with Yame) Gyokuro from O-Cha.

Regarding placing tea back into cold storage after opening. This is always a bit controversial. I believe you can if proper precautions are taken, and I do this. But I always add that it is risky and I do not recommend this if you are not prepared to take all precautions ... and risks. Of course having a TeaFridge greatly reduces the risk factor, but still precautions are critical for success.

Since this is also a beginner gyokuro topic ... there is always a question of whether to try an entry level offering ... or get the best to start. Hm, this would actually be a very good seperate topic.

[JRS22]

My 3rd attempt at steeping the Yame Gyokuro was much more successful. I preheated the kyusu and brewed at 140 degrees for 40 seconds. There may have been the slightest touch of bitterness, but I felt that it enhanced the flavor. While preheating the kyusu is a nuisance, I remembered to enjoy the aroma of the dry tea in the heated pot. Yum. Now a bit more testing to capture more of that rich sweet aroma in the brewed tea.

I've moved my gyokuro from the freezer to the main tea cabinet. When I first opened the bag I placed some of the tea in a sample tin inside a double lidded cannister. Then, since the O-Cha package is not resealable, I rolled the bag shut, clipped it to hold the folds in place, and put it in a resealable tea bag from Upton Teas. (If I paid as close attention to lectures in college as I do to postings on Tea Chat I probably would have made Phi Betta Kappa!)

[Chip]

Excellent, now keep going. With Gyokuro, practice makes perfect tea!

[Tead Off]

Since this is also a beginner gyokuro topic ... there is always a question of whether to try an entry level offering ... or get the best to start. Hm, this would actually be a very good seperate topic.

Why not go for the best right away? It sets a mark from which to explore from provided the drinker has some fluency with tea. Maybe if the drinker is new to tea, they should gain some experience with other teas first as the cost can be considerably high to learn how to brew.

I came to Japanese teas after years of drinking good Chinese teas. Developing one's taste takes time as you have to sort through a lot of mediocre teas to get at the really good ones. And, yes, there are many mediocre teas sold by many online vendors that are popular on this board. It's an expensive obsession that only get worse.

[Chip]

Why not go for the best right away? It sets a mark from which to explore from provided the drinker has some fluency with tea. Maybe if the drinker is new to tea, they should gain some experience with other teas first as the cost can be considerably high to learn how to brew.

I came to Japanese teas after years of drinking good Chinese teas. Developing one's taste takes time as you have to sort through a lot of mediocre teas to get at the really good ones. And, yes, there are many mediocre teas sold by many online vendors that are popular on this board. It's an expensive obsession that only get worse.

This comes down to a fundamental philosophy (or at least personal preference), though it seems you are expressing both sides as correct?

My personal experience was entry level and worked my way up. This worked for me pretty well. But I can understand wanting to go for the best first, then explore. BUT it is harder to downgrade than it is to upgrade.

I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to this, it will come down to how one wants to learn about teas. Gaining experience with lesser teas really helped refine my brewing, and helped me to embrace challenges in brewing.

[olivierco]

BUT it is harder to downgrade than it is to upgrade.

Downgrading? Strange idea...

[Chip]

BUT it is harder to downgrade than it is to upgrade.

Downgrading? Strange idea...

Certainly not mine ...

[entropyembrace]

Personally I go for high grade first when trying new types of tea. If I had gone from my last tea order...which was some excellent Taiwan oolongs from Floating Leaves Tea to an entry level sencha I doubt I would have been very impressed or interested in the sencha. Having my first sip of sencha being the Yutaka Midori Supreme from O-Cha got me excited and launched sencha into my favourites with oolong and darjeeling.

Though, that´s from the perspective of already being familiar with high grade tea from other genres...I think even if you´re fairly new to tea high grade tea can speak to you of it´s quality without any assistance which gives the newbie some idea of how amazing tea can be, and also the higher grade teas are usually easier to brew than the low grades.

[Teacup1980]

If the tea is bitter, I recommend to steep the tea with cold water. Into the cold water, not so many caffeine and tannin (bitterness) is extracted, but theanine (sweetness) comes out as time passes.

If the tea is bitter even you steep with cold water, the tea is not for you. Gyokuro is usually has much sweet taste and less bitterness than Sencha or other teas. But if you don't like Gyokuro, I recommend Kukicha. Kukicha has much more theanine (sweetness).