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Aug 7th, '15, 22:55
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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by Tead Off » Aug 7th, '15, 22:55

StavA wrote:Oh boy...It may have been a mistake for me to join this forum. Not sure that this ends well for my children's college savings plans.

An old professor of mine once said that when you get educated you are mainly expanding your ability to suffer. When you don't know what good music is anything sounds fine. But once your taste in music gets sophisticated common music playing in the supermarket or at a restaurant becomes annoying and even painful....
It's just sound, like a dog barking
Only your mind, gives it value :lol: :lol:

Aug 9th, '15, 17:49
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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by StavA » Aug 9th, '15, 17:49

Thanks for sharing this.

Can one taste the difference in hand rolled sencha? Or is the difference primarily visual?

Not to minimize the value if it's only visual; I have experienced the joy of simply looking at the full sencha leaves -- just curious if it has a taste impact as well.


sherubtse wrote:
https://japaneseteasommelier.wordpress. ... t-saitama/

Best wishes,
sherubtse

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by sherubtse » Aug 9th, '15, 22:52

StavA wrote:Can one taste the difference in hand rolled sencha? Or is the difference primarily visual?

Not to minimize the value if it's only visual; I have experienced the joy of simply looking at the full sencha leaves -- just curious if it has a taste impact as well.
I can't say, as I have never had temomi-cha. Tead Off and Chip (and perhaps others) are the ones who would know.

Best wishes,
sherubtse

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by Tead Off » Aug 10th, '15, 00:37

StavA wrote:Thanks for sharing this.

Can one taste the difference in hand rolled sencha? Or is the difference primarily visual?

Not to minimize the value if it's only visual; I have experienced the joy of simply looking at the full sencha leaves -- just curious if it has a taste impact as well.
Yes, you can taste the difference. But, perhaps all hand rolled sencha are also not equal. A lot depends on the Tea Master behind the processing and the quality of the leaves. Usually, if someone is hand processing, they will begin with good quality leaves. You really have to dive in and get the experience yourself.

With Dancong oolongs, I have had many poor to mediocre teas which exhibit beautiful looking leaves. It's really deceiving and very disappointing when you encounter this.

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Aug 11th, '15, 11:21
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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by shinobicha » Aug 11th, '15, 11:21

chingwa wrote:I can attest to their quality. I've been getting the majority of my tea there for the last 3 years and the quality, honestly, is far better than any other vendor I've tried.
I second this; I have been ordering from them since 2011 and have never been disappointed. Of course certain teas stand out more than others, but they are always interesting, complex, and enjoyable.

Plus, if you find the teas you want, switch the language to Japanese, and pay in Yen, you can save a bit, due to the favorable exchange rates right now - 20% or so.

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by shinobicha » Aug 11th, '15, 11:23

StavA wrote:Thanks for sharing this.
Can one taste the difference in hand rolled sencha? Or is the difference primarily visual?
Absolutely; I have had temomicha from Hiruma-en and from Sugimoto USA (they carry a limited amount each May), it is amazing tea. If you can deal with Google translate and ordering from Hiruma-en (you can also search these forums for more info. on how to), you can try temomicha for a lower price (as others said $3.50 for a 3g serving).

Aug 11th, '15, 16:46
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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by StavA » Aug 11th, '15, 16:46

shinobicha wrote:
chingwa wrote:I can attest to their quality. I've been getting the majority of my tea there for the last 3 years and the quality, honestly, is far better than any other vendor I've tried.
I second this; I have been ordering from them since 2011 and have never been disappointed. Of course certain teas stand out more than others, but they are always interesting, complex, and enjoyable.

Plus, if you find the teas you want, switch the language to Japanese, and pay in Yen, you can save a bit, due to the favorable exchange rates right now - 20% or so.
Chingwa, Shinobicha,

OK, I'm in. What Asamushi do you suggest from Thes Du Japon? I'll probably get 3 or so to dilute the shipping costs.

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by hobin » Aug 11th, '15, 18:55

go for the tamawaka yamakai cultivar.

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by miig » Aug 12th, '15, 08:36

Hmm, interesting discussion! While there of course is a lot of subjectivity involved, I'd say that many people will agree that there is a middle ground which offers the best price-quality ratio.
The very cheap teas are not worth their money or the time involved at all, and the more expensive teas take a lot of money to buy and a lot of experience and time involved to appreciate. They have their place, but as others said, they are not for every day.

Interesting metaphors for the asa vs. fuka discussion. I for example found fukamushi teas often more difficult to appreciate, the bright and sweet aromas of asamushi were more appealing to begin with. So i though that fukamushi is in a way a tea for advanced drinkers :)
That is not to say that the one is of better quality than the other - just my impression. And if we are throwing around metaphors, for me a good asamushi is like listening to Mozart or Beethoven - even though there is a lot in it which i probably will only highly educated and talented people will 'get', most people can easily find something enjoyable in that kind of music.

Drinking Fukamushi often reminds me about listening to more abstract, more modern musik - lets say Shostakovich or even Schönberg. Its not "better" or "worse" music than the others, but if you hear it for the first time, chances are that you won'*t appreciate it right away. Its less candy-like, it has fewer of these elements which please you right away, you need to get a certain familarity with it in order to appreciate is aesthetics.

Of course that metaphor only works so far :)

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by Tead Off » Aug 12th, '15, 10:51

miig, I think for me, your explanation is exactly upside down. :lol: I find nothing abstract about fukamushi. Another poster described it as being 'in your face'. I would have to agree with comment.

I'm not saying you're wrong in your view, but most of the seasoned drinkers I hear from regard asamushi as more refined and complex. I can relate to the Mozart aspect of asamushi, but not to the Beethoven. I see little in common in the two, except genius in different ways.

As for the middle ground/price-quality ratio, this is what most people on Teachat shoot for and represents a different level of appreciation than the casual drinker has. But there are those who wish to up their game and only want to drink the best they can find. The tea game has many aficionados who can afford high end teas, just like those single malt drinkers who will not hesitate to lay down serious bucks for a bottle.

But, as long as you're enjoying what you're drinking, it's all good.

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by StavA » Aug 12th, '15, 11:31

Let's agree up front that nothing is 'better' or 'worse' it's all subjective and matter of personal taste.

But if we keep working with the musical analogy: For me, if Asamushi is Mozart I would say that Fukamushi is the Finale of the William Tell Overture or possibly of the 1812 Overture.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7O91GDWGPU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2W1Wi2U9sQ

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by Chip » Aug 12th, '15, 11:36

I prefer to have a fukushima and an asamushi open at any given time, alternating between the two.

I like the explosion of flavors and aromas of fuka. Fireworks.

I like the artistry in appearance, flavor and aroma of asa. An orchestra.

If I only have an asa open, I grow tired of asa and crave fuka.
If I only have fuka open, I grow bored of fuka and crave asa.

"Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don't."

Aug 12th, '15, 11:42
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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by StavA » Aug 12th, '15, 11:42

Tead Off wrote:The tea game has many aficionados who can afford high end teas, just like those single malt drinkers who will not hesitate to lay down serious bucks for a bottle.
I am happy you brought up the whisky / scotch situation.

For some whisky the price point / quality levels are worthwhile and obvious. Best example is the Johnny Walker Black is about 1000x better than Johnny Walker Red. Red is horrid paint thinner. Black is sublime.

But Johnny Walker Gold...meh, really not so different from Black in my opinion and it is a lot more expensive.

Are the higher end Sencha like that? With diminishing returns on $ with little difference from Black to Gold?

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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by shinobicha » Aug 12th, '15, 14:22

You have to be careful and go with trusted vendors. There ARE indeed vendors charging outrageous prices (most of them are not recommended here on TC) with highly diminishing returns.

Rather than tell you which asamushi you should go with from Thes Du Japon, check out his own blog where he recommends you to start, since his selection is so broad:
https://japaneseteasommelier.wordpress. ... anese-tea/

I can personally recommend the Okawa-Oma Sencha, or anything from the Tamakawa estate (haven't tried them all, but the Yokosawa is very good and a lower price ratio compared to others from that producer). TdJ also has fukamushi, but only a few. Fukamushi has become very popular and as a result it can be overdone and pushed to the extreme. It can also be done elegantly. Besides TdJ the higher end fukas from O-cha and Den's tea are pretty good.

Aug 18th, '15, 11:49
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Re: The taste power and financial value of Sencha leaves

by StavA » Aug 18th, '15, 11:49

Chingwa, Hobin, Shino, and others:

As suggested I ordered and received some Sencha from Thes Du Japon.

Yes, this is exactly what I was looking for. Well worth the price premium.

Thanks for the guidance.

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