Young vs. old shu

[bagua7]

Any major differences between the two?

Does aging affect significantly the nature of the cooked "pu"?

When does a shu become old?

I am still trying to figure things out since I am new to this specific puerh.

Cheers.

[IPT]

There is a huge difference between aged and new Shupu! It ages beautifully. I have found that it takes at least 15 years for it to really age to perfection, but it is incredible stuff.

[bagua7]

Wow! Didn't know that. I guess it's time to explore aged shu. I'll put in store the young ones I purchased recently.

Thanks for the info.

[G-off-re]

I like young shu but i prefer the taste of pre-2000's shu. It becomes really smooth and mellow with a nice aged aroma. library, talcum and toasted nuts come to mind. The major flaw i see is that its $$$$ but still less than aged sheng. If you like new shu Its worth at least picking up some samples to see what it turns into. YS has a fully dry stored cake from mid 90's that sounds interesting but my suspicion is that shu is more interesting when exposed to a bit of controlled humidity. I could be wrong though.

[MarshalN]

Just buy traditionally stored aged shu pu -- far superior to the dry stored stuff

[fdrx]

i don't know much about old/young shu but i feel like young shu has sometimes a salty taste

[bearsbearsbears]

I disagree that there's a "huge" difference between young and old shu. Even if the older shu was in wetter or traditional storage, the taste difference isn't very dramatic; it merely has gained a "storage taste".

For me, it's a value question: 3 year old shu and 10 year old shu stored dry taste roughly the same, but the 10 year old shu will cost 5-10 times more.

[shah82]

I think shu is a lot more prone to becoming stale than sheng.

[bagua7]

For me, it's a value question: 3 year old shu and 10 year old shu stored dry taste roughly the same, but the 10 year old shu will cost 5-10 times more.

(I think you are right)

Anyway I just purchased this today:

http://cgi.ebay.com/2003-Top-Grade-Mini ... 336654148d

After the vendor placed a sample with some 2008 Dayi V93 I received this week. And it really impressed me (not that 2003 is really an old shu)...maybe it was really the novelty about drinking it with an aged hongni shi piao I got with me rather than the age of the 'pu' itself.

[TomVerlain]

Some shu has various degrees of fermented leaf. Blending different degrees of fermented upto sheng gives a profile to give the best aging potential.

The teas that are completely fermented to (me) a orangey color seem to peak quickly in the pot, and probably won't have any taste benefit over 5 years old.

just my take on it.

[wyardley]

I have had some older shu which is quite nice. I don't know if this the benefit of the aging itself, or because the style of production, level of "ripening", or quality of leaf was different then. Many older shu teas do have less heavily fermented leaf, and so do seem to benefit somewhat from aging.

But for the most part, I agree there's not much benefit beyond some initial resting / aging period to minimize the wodui taste. I am generally very reluctant to spend much money on aged shu, at least without trying it and having it be mind-blowing. And I drink so little shu that I don't spend a lot of time seeking it out.

It does seem like, at least with some storage environments, shu can get a little flat or less smooth for a period of time. I don't know if this is a permanent problem or an "awkward" phase like many aged teas go through.

[gingkoseto]

I disagree that there's a "huge" difference between young and old shu.

To a large degree, I agree with this statement of bear's.

In another aspect, to me, the main difference between most new shu and older shu is the difference between new, stinky tea and well-aerated, non-stinky tea. But this thought may just reflect I am not a big fan of shu to begin with

Also I don't think it's possible to say generally how many years a shu should be aged. 7262 and 7581 are two examples that make such generalization impossible.

If I look for a shu, I do consider dry storage only. But then, to me, it's not a bad thing if other people would like to take the wet storage

[tingjunkie]

For me, it's a value question: 3 year old shu and 10 year old shu stored dry taste roughly the same, but the 10 year old shu will cost 5-10 times more.

The difference between 3-10 year old shu is usually moderate. I've been lucky enough to try a handful of 20-30 year old shu though. That's when it starts getting noticeably more wonderful. And the original loose Golden Lotus White Needle... out of this world!

[wyardley]

Also I don't think it's possible to say generally how many years a shu should be aged. 7262 and 7581 are two examples that make such generalization impossible.

If I'm not mistaken, some of these big factories actually rest the tea for several years after production already.

[bearsbearsbears]

For me, it's a value question: 3 year old shu and 10 year old shu stored dry taste roughly the same, but the 10 year old shu will cost 5-10 times more.

The difference between 3-10 year old shu is usually moderate.

2008 7262 = 95 kuai
2001 7262 = 680 kuai
680/95 = over 7 times more expensive.
90s 7262 = 1600 kuai = almost 17 times more expensive
70s/80s 7262 = "market price"

7262 is a recipe I enjoy. I have had the 2008 and ones from earlier in the 2000s and one supposedly from the late 90s. They were not better by a factor of 7 let alone 17. In fact, the fermentation is pretty high on this recipe, and I couldn't detect age having any effect beyond the year to air out the tea. Menghai ages their shu before pressing, so even this airing out is a minimal effect.

08 Xiaguan Xiao Fa Tuo = 10 kuai
01 Xiaguan Xiao Fa Tuo = 98 kuai
98/10 = almost 10 times as expensive
90s Xiao Fa = 250 kuai = 25 times more expensive
80s Xiao Fa = 1800 kuai (250g) = 72 times more expensive

Having tasted these, 80s Xiao Fa tuo not 72 times better than 2008, in my book. Nor is 90s 25 times better than 2008. This is a tea that does benefit from a year or more of airing out, but beyond a few years they taste more or less the same.

Recipes with lighter fermented leaf in the blend (7562, 7452, 7581, etc.) I find gain very little additional interest with age.

I respect that some people here have different experiences with aged shu, and clearly these market prices reflect a group of people disagree with my opinion of the quality and valuation of these teas, but my personal tastes and price judgment continue to lead me to young and young-ish shu.