User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 09:24
Posts: 1953
Joined: Apr 6th, '08, 19:02
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Contact: chamekke

Show Off Your Pots and Cups, Part IV

by chamekke » Jun 25th, '08, 09:24

Moderator Edit: Find out what led up to this conversation at "Show Off Your Pots and Cups, Part III."
britt wrote:
chamekke wrote:However, it still focuses on male symbols and the traits traditionally associated with maleness (the kabuto or samurai helmet; the iris and its leaves, which are said to resemble sword blades;
Chamekke- thanks for answering a question that I never actually asked. I recently saw a Kyo-yaki tea cup added to a vendor's web-store in celebration of Boy's Day. It had a very cool samurai helmet painted on the cup, along with three types of flowers. When I saw it I asked myself, "why do they always screw up these male themes by adding flowers to them?" Now I know why.

Although I didn't know the difference between the three types of flowers before, after your comparison of the Iris to sword blades it's easy to pick out the Iris, and yes, they do mimic sword blades quite well.

Image
Wow, that's a beautiful yunomi!

My impression is that the Japanese don't think of flowers as necessarily "feminine" in the way that we Westerners tend to. And in the case of the iris, the flower really is decidedly "masculine". (On Children's Day, kiddies often engage in "swordplay" with iris leaves.) I'm assuming your cup includes wisteria simply because it also blooms in May. The third flower (not visible in this photo, but you can see it on the original webpage) is hydrangea, which I guess is really a late-May flower - usually more associated with June actually. So the selection of the last two is probably purely seasonal.

There are several folk beliefs to do with the iris, or shobu. I'm going to be lazy and quote yet another webpage rather than trying to paraphrase from memory. Hopefully people won't mind me sliding off topic for the umpteenth time:
Shobu, the Japanese iris, the long narrow leaf of which is somewhat like a sword in shape, has always been closely associated with the Boys' Festival. The iris leaf is prominent in the observance of Tango-no-Sekku because the sound of the word Shobu, although written with different characters, implies striving for success.

On May 5, the Japanese steep the leaves in hot water and enjoy the fragrant Shobu-yu (iris hot-bath) because of the traditional belief that the iris bath is a miraculous prophylactic against all kinds of sickness. Many public bath houses, particularly in the districts where the people are less affected by western influence and are accustomed to taking hot baths in the morning, open their doors early in the morning on May 4 and 5.

Also for the festival, finely chopped iris leaves are mixed with Sake to produce a drink (Shobu-sake) especially enjoyed by the Samurai of old.

In ancient times, iris leaves were also believed to have the mysterious power of extinguishing fire and for this reason, in rural areas today, people still observe the custom of putting iris leaves on the eaves of their houses on May 5 as a talisman against the possible outbreak of a fire or presence of evil spirits.
Edited to add:
P.S. On Boys' Day it's traditional to include either a kabuto by itself, or a "warrior doll" (musha-ningyo) as part of the display. The doll may portray a male samurai in full armour, or one of the boy-heroes of folklore, such as Kintaro. All the figures are male except for one - the (legendary) Empress Jingu, who was said to have donned her dead husband's armour to successfully complete his military campaign in Korea. She is usually shown wearing her armour, while her elderly general Takenouchi - who holds her infant son, the future emperor Ojin - stands at her side. There's a very nice Empress Jingu doll here on Trocadero.

For more on Boys' Day and its symbolism, including even more details on the iris, see this great article on the website L'Asie Exotique.

Sorry to go on at such length, but I do love this stuff...

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 11:07
Posts: 666
Joined: Aug 28th, '07, 13:32
Location: Northeast Georgia

by henley » Jun 25th, '08, 11:07

britt wrote:
Victoria wrote: Another legend says that the carps able to leap over the Dragon Gate would become dragons. Several waterfalls and cataracts in China are believed to be the location of the Dragon Gate. This legend is an allegory of the drive and efforts needed to overcome obstacles.
This legend is actually true. I tried it and it worked. You see the Arita Dragon cup in my avatar? It used to be an Arita carp cup like Salsero's.
Too funny!!!Image

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 13:33
Posts: 763
Joined: Jun 7th, '08, 11:47

by britt » Jun 25th, '08, 13:33

chamekke wrote:Wow, that's a beautiful yunomi!

My impression is that the Japanese don't think of flowers as necessarily "feminine" in the way that we Westerners tend to. ...I'm assuming your cup......
I included the picture of the cup as a reference; I'm too westernized to have actually purchased it! Your explanation helps me understand why flowers and military helmets aren't such a crazy match, at least in the East.

Some books I have read on samurai initially shocked me when I found out that samurai training included courses such as tea ceremony and flower arranging. I had thought samurai were tough; they're actually tough but well rounded!

chamekke wrote:Also for the festival, finely chopped iris leaves are mixed with Sake to produce a drink (Shobu-sake) especially enjoyed by the Samurai of old.
Now this is more like it! It sounds interesting and I do like sake.

chamekke wrote:Sorry to go on at such length, but I do love this stuff...
No complaints from me, I'm glad you are so open with what you have learned about Japanese culture. I find it fascinating. It would take me hours online to find what you so generously supply in a few paragraphs. I, and I'm sure many others on this forum, appreciate these info sessions and hope you will continue with them.

Great links, thanks!

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 15:18
Posts: 505
Joined: Jun 1st, '08, 11:57
Location: The Golden Horseshoe

by heavydoom » Jun 25th, '08, 15:18

i need a zhu ni pot like this one below, smallish volume between 10cl - 12cl, some links to stores online would be most helpful :

Image

rishi, who i don't really trust, has one but it is a big volume one. 8 oz. yikes.


thanks to salsero whose picture i used, i hope you don't mind. :D

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 15:53
Posts: 35
Joined: Jun 25th, '08, 11:17
Location: Florida

by cane » Jun 25th, '08, 15:53

This thread is great!
It actually got me to stop being a lurker and actually sign up on teachat.
Though its dangerous, I have found new and expensive places to shop!
I am at the office, so here are a few pics I had on hand, will post more of my collection after I am home and get the camera out!
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 16:11
Posts: 20891
Joined: Apr 22nd, '06, 20:52
Scrolling: scrolling
Location: Back in the TeaCave atop Mt. Fuji
Been thanked: 2 times

by Chip » Jun 25th, '08, 16:11

Nice teaware, Cane...welcome to TeaChat and thanx for sharing!!!
blah blah blah SENCHA blah blah blah!!!

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 16:34
Posts: 334
Joined: Jul 8th, '07, 17:19
Location: Submerged in a good cuppa

by Eastree » Jun 25th, '08, 16:34

My Fukugata has arrived!

I placed the box out
Image

Then I cut the tape and opened the box ...
Image

Image

Image

And inside was my new kyuusu!
Image

(all images are links)

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 18:07
Posts: 2625
Joined: May 31st, '08, 02:44
Scrolling: scrolling
Location: Portland, OR
Contact: Geekgirl

by Geekgirl » Jun 25th, '08, 18:07

Eastree wrote:My Fukugata has arrived!

I placed the box out...


And inside was my new kyuusu!
Image

(all images are links)
Very nice! I'm still wavering on fukugata, kikumaru, or a pot on AR. :shock: Plus I'm beginning to realize a very strong preference for chinese style teas that is in direct conflict with my equally strong preference for Japanese style teaware. :shock: :shock:

What's a girl (with a budget) to do? If I want more toys I'll have to accept more clients, but I can't do thaaaat!!! I wanna be LAAAAAZY. :lol:

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 18:51
Posts: 2299
Joined: Oct 23rd, '06, 19:46
Location: Seattle Area
Contact: tenuki

by tenuki » Jun 25th, '08, 18:51

GeekgirlUnveiled wrote:
What's a girl (with a budget) to do? If I want more toys I'll have to accept more clients, but I can't do thaaaat!!! I wanna be LAAAAAZY. :lol:
Happiness is the skill of completely enjoying what you already have.

I take this to mean that I should completely enjoy my teaware purchasing habit, since that is what I have.
Do something different, something different will happen. ( Gong Fu Garden )

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 18:53
Posts: 2625
Joined: May 31st, '08, 02:44
Scrolling: scrolling
Location: Portland, OR
Contact: Geekgirl

by Geekgirl » Jun 25th, '08, 18:53

tenuki wrote:
I take this to mean that I should completely enjoy my teaware purchasing habit, since that is what I have.
*nods vigorously*

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 22:22
Posts: 763
Joined: Jun 7th, '08, 11:47

by britt » Jun 25th, '08, 22:22

heavydoom wrote:i need a zhu ni pot like this one below, smallish volume between 10cl - 12cl, some links to stores online would be most helpful
Six Yixings, all claimed to be made of Zhuni clay, between 60cc and 120cc:

http://www.1001plateaus.com/index.cgi?p ... 0470.32378

Image

I have not purchased from this source so I am not making a recommendation or vouching for the authenticity of the clay. I'm simply passing along info that is in line with your request. Maybe some other forum member has purchased an Yixing from 1001 Plateaus?

Edit: After looking again at this website, I have two things that bother me:

1. I thought Zhuni was always red, but there are four different colors shown and they all claim to be Zhuni clay.

2. At least one of them states it uses super-porous Zhuni clay, but I thought Zhuni was the least porous (I think someone said that on this site).

I'm no expert on Yixings, but I'd try to verify these two things before making a purchase from this vendor.
Last edited by britt on Jun 25th, '08, 22:36, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 22:26
Posts: 505
Joined: Jun 1st, '08, 11:57
Location: The Golden Horseshoe

by heavydoom » Jun 25th, '08, 22:26

britt wrote:
heavydoom wrote:i need a zhu ni pot like this one below, smallish volume between 10cl - 12cl, some links to stores online would be most helpful
Six Yixings, all claimed to be made of Zhuni clay, between 60cc and 120cc:

http://www.1001plateaus.com/index.cgi?p ... 0470.32378

Image

I have not purchased from this source so I am not making a recommendation or vouching for the authenticity of the clay. I'm simply passing along info that is in line with your request. Maybe some other forum member has purchased an Yixing from 1001 Plateaus?
thanks for that, i actually bumped into that site by googling this afternoon.

stephane erler from tea master just told me that he may re stock this pot again, in about 3 months time. so hold onto your pennies and just wait. my brother has one, and it is just perfect.

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 22:42
Posts: 763
Joined: Jun 7th, '08, 11:47

by britt » Jun 25th, '08, 22:42

heavydoom wrote:thanks for that, i actually bumped into that site by googling this afternoon.

stephane erler from tea master just told me that he may re stock this pot again, in about 3 months time. so hold onto your pennies and just wait. my brother has one, and it is just perfect.
As you were replying, I added an edit where I expressed some doubts about the Yixings at 1001 Plateaus. I don't know if these doubts are legitimate or not, but as many Yixings use questionable clay, are of poor quality, and have safety issues, I think you are wise to wait and buy from a trusted source.
Last edited by britt on Jun 25th, '08, 22:44, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 22:43
Posts: 505
Joined: Jun 1st, '08, 11:57
Location: The Golden Horseshoe

by heavydoom » Jun 25th, '08, 22:43

britt wrote:
heavydoom wrote:thanks for that, i actually bumped into that site by googling this afternoon.

stephane erler from tea master just told me that he may re stock this pot again, in about 3 months time. so hold onto your pennies and just wait. my brother has one, and it is just perfect.
As you were replying, I added an edit where I expressed some doubts about the Yixings at 1001 Plateaus. I don't know if these doubts are legitimate or not, but as many Yixings use questionable clay, quality, and safety I think you are wise to wait and buy from a trusted source.
exactly. that is why i will just wait for stephane to get more in of that pot. he is 100 % trust worthy.

User avatar
Jun 25th, '08, 22:50
Posts: 763
Joined: Jun 7th, '08, 11:47

by britt » Jun 25th, '08, 22:50

heavydoom wrote:exactly. that is why i will just wait for stephane to get more in of that pot. he is 100 % trust worthy.
Some say stephane's prices are high, but if you are this confident that his Yixings are authentic, then the price isn't so high after all. This can be a confusing subject, and I think many who are unaware of the problems compare $19.99 Yixings claiming to be Zhuni with $150 ones claiming to be the same, thinking the higher priced one is a rip-off. It's not a rip-off if it's real and the cheaper one is a fake that gets its color from the addition of dangerous industrial dyes.

Locked