The Darjeeling limited....

[TIM]

3 Brothers from Darjeeling. I am very new to black tea, if these are even considered as black?

These are all 2008 fall harvest. But the color, character and texture are very different. So, do you consider then Red, Black or oolong tea? And which one is better.....

1. Rohini Wonder
2. Avongrove Orgainic
3. Red Thunder



If anyone could enlighten me on what should I be looking for in Indian tea?

Happy New Year : )

[shardy53]

All three are Oolongs. Why don't you try some of the Adagio Assams and Darjeelings? You really have to try them and see what you like.

Steve

[TIM]

All three are Oolongs. Why don't you try some of the Adagio Assams and Darjeelings? You really have to try them and see what you like.

Steve

Thanks Steve, so these are all Darjeeling oolongs?

[shardy53]

Tim,
I Googled all three and that is what I came up with.

Steve

[TIM]

Tim,
I Googled all three and that is what I came up with.

Steve

Steve- have you had oolong from DJLings before? So if the tea is that oxidated, do you consider it red, black?

Thanks-T

[shardy53]

Tim,
I have never dealt with them. I am also fairly new to tea so I am only telling yoiu what I have learned in the last few months. I do know that Oolong is is in between green and black tea. It has oxidized but the oxidation was stopped at some point in the process.

Check out these videos to learn more about tea. They are very good. I watched them multiple times and learned a lot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrqBe9sWHsk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RA7aJqf ... re=related

[Salsero]

I don't know that I understand all this too well, but many Darjeelings these days consist of a lot of green-colored leaf and a light flavor. Somewhere (I might be able to find a reference if someone really wants it) I read an explanation by Nigel Melican about why these green looking leaves were actually fully oxidized black tea.

The trend in Darjeelings for quite a few years now has been to move toward more and more light, fruity, and oolong-like teas. The market apparently goes for this profile while some long-time Darjeeling drinkers complain. The complexity is compounded by the fact that more and more tea labeled as oolong is also coming from the region.

As for these three offeringa, I have no specific information.

[Intuit]

Avon Grove Organic doesn't appear to be a Darjeeling oolong, but you can't tell from your posted images of the three Darjeelings. The other two are described as oolongs and are well recommended from reviews on other websites.

I haven't had a Indian oolong in recent years, so I can't advise on which to purchase. Last time I purchased a Darjeeling oolong, it was back in 2002 or 2003 and I honestly can't remember the estate from which it originated, but I suspect it was a Makaibari Estate Oolong because I bought it from Silver Tips tea company and that's their signature estate teas (they're producers as well as retailers).

I would agree with their website description - it's got the fruity/muscatel character but not the smokey aftertaste.

Gophaldara estate is the origin of the 2nd Flush Red Thunder oolong (they also had a 'wonder' oolong product in the past). Spendy.

The Chinese term for black tea is 'red' tea, referring to the red liquor extract.

It might be prudent to familiarize your palate with less costly versions and try small samples of the 'good stuff' at spaced intervals. You should be able to detect flavor character differences more easily.

Nilgiri teas are also produced as oolongs, and apparently high grown Assams are as well. I've got a couple of producer/retailers sending me samples so that I can compare them, as I'm much more familiar with Chinese and Taiwanese oolongs than their Indian counterpart.

[TIM]

Avon Grove Organic doesn't appear to be a Darjeeling oolong, but you can't tell from your posted images of the three Darjeelings. The other two are described as oolongs and are well recommended from reviews on other websites.

I haven't had a Indian oolong in recent years, so I can't advise on which to purchase. Last time I purchased a Darjeeling oolong, it was back in 2002 or 2003 and I honestly can't remember the estate from which it originated, but I suspect it was a Makaibari Estate Oolong because I bought it from Silver Tips tea company and that's their signature estate teas (they're producers as well as retailers).

I would agree with their website description - it's got the fruity/muscatel character but not the smokey aftertaste.

Gophaldara estate is the origin of the 2nd Flush Red Thunder oolong (they also had a 'wonder' oolong product in the past). Spendy.

The Chinese term for black tea is 'red' tea, referring to the red liquor extract.

It might be prudent to familiarize your palate with less costly versions and try small samples of the 'good stuff' at spaced intervals. You should be able to detect flavor character differences more easily.

Nilgiri teas are also produced as oolongs, and apparently high grown Assams are as well. I've got a couple of producer/retailers sending me samples so that I can compare them, as I'm much more familiar with Chinese and Taiwanese oolongs than their Indian counterpart.

Thanks Intuit for the info. I love Gophaldara estate wonder oolong 1st flush, and that's what really got me hooked. These are from GE besides the Avon Grove?

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/1001 ... 6097.1.jpg

A First Flush wonder tea from GE 2006. I am aging it to compare to the new harvest and studying its aging ability.

[Intuit]

List of Darjeeling tea estates:

http://www.exploredarjeeling.com/estates2.htm

List of tea products from Avon Grove:

http://www.avongrovetea.com/ourteas.html

Gopaldhara (Gopal is the name of the original land owner and dhara is the local word for natural (spring fed) streams) is a very high altitude estate, at 7400 ft above mean sea level. Their first flush black teas have a distinctly green look to them, which may explain why you like them so much.


Two trends are becoming evident among Indian tea producers:

1. Increased processing of green and white teas, sometimes ceasing traditional black tea processing completely.

2. Willingness to expand tea region branding to other tea products (white, green, scented single estates and blends, oolongs).

The intention is to increase specialty tea niche market sales abroad, especially in Europe and the Middle East, the fastest growing tea markets.

[joelbct]

Good film....

[RandomCaribou]

This is a very interesting discussion...

How, then, do you determine a black tea or oolong? By the dry tea's structure and appearance, or by the brewed result? Or a combination of both? I've come across darker-roasted oolongs and light Darjeelings (which I've just always considered a black tea, even though I know Darj is only a region name, so the produced teas could theoretically be any oxidation level).

[Salsero]

Well, here is a quotation from RFDT that attempts to explain why Darjeelings can look green and still be black. (You may have to be signed up in Google Groups RFDT to access that link.) In reality, it seems to me that hard wither (a wither without sufficient moisture for the oxidation to progress) is just another way of achieving partial oxidation and so oolong.

• Dear friends,
  
  Ankit Lochan has posted an observation which indeed is from up close!
  However, let me try to Demystify the Green in Darjeeling Black.
  Traditionally, Darjeeling Planters pluck very fine. And then these
  tender shoots, which as it is comes from the tiny chinary varieties,
  are subjected to high degree of Withering. Withered Leaf : Made Tea
  ratio of 60 % is not uncommon.
  What happens due to such high degree of wither is that the shoots have
  just sufficient amount of juice concentrates in them to ooze out and
  cover itself when rolled under pressure.
  Now comes the cach ; when the average recovery is 60 %, it is but
  natural that there would be some shoots which have virtually dried up
  during withering. These shoots are the ones which do get cell damage
  and subsequent Oxidation, but lack the juices to cover themselves
  with.
  And hence, they remain Green inspite of being Black!
  
  Any comments?
  
  Regards,
  Jayesh pandya.

Mmmm, sounds a bit like double speak. It may be that the Darjeeling tea industry just doesn't want to call the bulk of their tea oolong.

[toastedtoads]

That actually seems like a fairly reasonable explanation. The greenish parts of the tea really just dried too fast to oxidize. Later on in the conversation Nigel points out that they're actually white tea. I'll buy that.

Also, what's The Tea Gallery doing with Indian tea? I thought they were Chinese only.

[Intuit]

The Darjeeling region is politically unstable at present, with tribals pushing for a separate state for reasons tied to cultural uniqueness and desperately needed governmental efficiency. The infrastructure in India is in terrible shape, but it's even more decrepit in rural areas.

Darjeeling is famous for its teas and tourist industry. Tourism follows from the relatively low pollution and cooler temperatures of the Himalayan foothills. Unfortunately, tourism has increased road use, hillside erosion, water shortages, solid waste overflow and is thought to be tied to growing air pollution problems.

Many active Darjeeling tea plantations aren't in the best of shape; there are also a number of previously active plantations that were shut down due to tribal strife.

A subset of older/closed plantations are to be renovated. Interest in expanding Darjeeling market into specialty teas (white, greens, oolongs) centers on the creation of new teas produced using premium "champagne" cultivars.

This move should increase the active acreage by nearly 70%, providing economic stability to the region and infrastructure funds, if it can be pulled off in a cooling global economy.

The Gorkhaland independence movement is drawing tribal support from other parts of India. Political unrest, a newly imposed (illegal) tax on tea buyers, and demand for change in branding to reflect the Gorkha peoples role in tea production threaten plans for regional / tea industry revitalization.

Indian teas rank up near the top in production volume and quality (many cultivar and technical improvements over the past several decades).

Not a surprise to hear that major tea vendors would consider stocking these teas to lure in new buyers as consumer spending wanes.